Trump Consciousness

Another placard Jim? I'd like to hear what you think about all this.
But if I thought you were being ironic here I could 'like' this. Trump just gets to talk like the 'common man' and explain to us, as if we're children, about how 'good' it is that "any school that does not uphold the First Amendments Rights (whatever they mean by that) of it(')s students will lose Federal Funding." That sounds like a threat. And quotes "I just want to compliment the President of the United (yeah right) States.." It is nice to get compliments, and quote them to those close enough to one to be interested and happy for you. In a 'speech' of 3 sentences it is not really informative, but possibly a well-placed political promulgation prop.
 
David, in post #589, I asked you a couple of direct questions to clarify your position. Could you please answer those? I will then address your own question.

Shall I take your silence in response to my request (despite your having since posted in this thread and others) as a "No", David?
 
Another placard Jim? I'd like to hear what you think about all this.
But if I thought you were being ironic here I could 'like' this. Trump just gets to talk like the 'common man' and explain to us, as if we're children, about how 'good' it is that "any school that does not uphold the First Amendments Rights (whatever they mean by that) of it(')s students will lose Federal Funding." That sounds like a threat. And quotes "I just want to compliment the President of the United (yeah right) States.." It is nice to get compliments, and quote them to those close enough to one to be interested and happy for you. In a 'speech' of 3 sentences it is not really informative, but possibly a well-placed political promulgation prop.

Besides which Trump has not told the truth in a tweet for so long you can safely dismiss anything he tweets has any reality outside Trumpland. It seems somewhat anomalous that tweets intended entirely for the dwellers in Trumpland manage to bleed into Never Trump Land. Its a pity that happens - and we non-Trumpians should ignore them, because they are not for us - and they make us unhappy.
 
Besides which Trump has not told the truth in a tweet for so long you can safely dismiss anything he tweets has any reality outside Trumpland. It seems somewhat anomalous that tweets intended entirely for the dwellers in Trumpland manage to bleed into Never Trump Land. Its a pity that happens - and we non-Trumpians should ignore them, because they are not for us - and they make us unhappy.
Yes, I think it has come to a point where whatever Trump says is bound to be reneged upon, or just said 'on a whim' so no wonder many people feel very uncertain about him. I was looking at the first amendment and see that it was not always held up in cases of free speech by 'undesirables' that is, persons who wished to challenge political injustice for eg. In the UK the National Front - who appear affiliated to the Nazi ideals and an all-white England, are allowed to demonstrate their ideology in public as an act of 'free-speech' so it is significant how the amendments are interpreted and used. The second amendment is used to entitle 'open-carry' (is that the term?) of guns, in public shopping areas, where it is surely not appropriate.
 
Yes, I think it has come to a point where whatever Trump says is bound to be reneged upon, or just said 'on a whim' so no wonder many people feel very uncertain about him. I was looking at the first amendment and see that it was not always held up in cases of free speech by 'undesirables' that is, persons who wished to challenge political injustice for eg. In the UK the National Front - who appear affiliated to the Nazi ideals and an all-white England, are allowed to demonstrate their ideology in public as an act of 'free-speech' so it is significant how the amendments are interpreted and used. The second amendment is used to entitle 'open-carry' (is that the term?) of guns, in public shopping areas, where it is surely not appropriate.
Why not come back to reality. Trump was elected partly because he promised to stop fighting pointless wars abroad - which he is doing - pulling ou of Syria was a part of that process. Hillary wanted to re-ingnite the war in Syria. Even now she tries to connect everyone she doesn't like with Russia.

The NF hardly exists anymore, so why weave them into your post just to get the words Trump and Nazi as close as possible?

Which person had more hateful policies?

David
 
Perhaps this thread perhaps should have been called Trump unconsciousness. In my eyes in order to support him you must remain unconscious about the many lies, The complete 180 flip on many of his election promises, the appointments of wall street gangsters in the financial sector, the appointments of military in civilian programs, the appointments of a drug company executive to the health department, special interest appointments overseeing the very thing that they have had a vested interest in profiting from. Hundreds of foxes overseeing there own personal hen houses.

Corporate executives and lobbyists are what make up Trumps government. He has quadrupled the number of lobbyists than in the previous two administrations. Clearly he places the corporations above that of the people. Instead of draining the swamp he filled it to monsoon levels. This is what you have to be unconscious of.

If a personal acquaintance had lied to you this many times for so long would you still keeps their acquaintance? Would you continue to trust anything they say? Maybe it is because people are so desperate for a Savior they become willingly blind. Government is not your friend. It is a big club, patting themselves on the back filling their pockets by dealing behind closed doors, and you are not part of it. Left or Right wing it is still part of the same corrupt dirty bird. Voting won't help you, for example....

I just found out even Tulsi Gabbard was or is a member of the CFR. It's all just a show you see, we only have the illusion of freedom and democracy.

4c520d5b64ae1fac.png


This is the witches pyramid or triangle of manifestation, a magical principle based on the power of three, time space and energy. Most people will just right this off because it is outside of their ideology. But believe me their are some who take this very seriously, whether true or not, whether you believe or not doesn't matter.
 
Trump was elected partly because he promised to stop fighting pointless wars abroad - which he is doing - pulling ou of Syria was a part of that process.

Is he though? Why wait three years to do what he promised? As far as I can tell, these troops in northern Syria are just being relocated and not coming home. He said he was going to pull out last year as well after declaring victory over ISIS. That did not happen. By some counts he has promised this 13 times.

Actually he has poured some 14,000 troops back into the region since May alone.
https://apnews.com/026e49c486234382850eb49d4361b108
This is hardly winding down fighting wars abroad.

These are the current US involved or backed operations ongoing, Seven at least, maybe I am missing some.

Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Niger, Somalia, Syria, and Yemen.

I would love to think he would finally be sticking to his promise even if three years late. Am I missing something?
 
Is he though? Why wait three years to do what he promised? As far as I can tell, these troops in northern Syria are just being relocated and not coming home. He said he was going to pull out last year as well after declaring victory over ISIS. That did not happen. By some counts he has promised this 13 times.

Actually he has poured some 14,000 troops back into the region since May alone.
https://apnews.com/026e49c486234382850eb49d4361b108
This is hardly winding down fighting wars abroad.

These are the current US involved or backed operations ongoing, Seven at least, maybe I am missing some.

Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Niger, Somalia, Syria, and Yemen.

I would love to think he would finally be sticking to his promise even if three years late. Am I missing something?
I really think you are. There is enormous resistance to his policies from the NeoCons and the Dems will go along with absolutely anything that is anti-trump.

As I think I said, the gas attacks were obviously not done by Assad's forces because they were aimed at bringing the US back into the war. In all probability they were ultimately organised by the NeoCons. Trump's position has been risky all along because the NeoCons hate him and the Dems hate him.

Trump's policy against Iran seems to be to box them in, and not go to war with them unless they decide to start something. As I understand it the 14000 troops are there to remind Iran that lashing out against the US would be extremely hazardous for them. Boxing in a bully does require troops, but he seems to be keeping Iran in a state of readiness which must be fantastically expensive so as to just wear them down.

David
 
I really think you are. There is enormous resistance to his policies from the NeoCons and the Dems will go along with absolutely anything that is anti-trump.

As I think I said, the gas attacks were obviously not done by Assad's forces because they were aimed at bringing the US back into the war. In all probability they were ultimately organised by the NeoCons. Trump's position has been risky all along because the NeoCons hate him and the Dems hate him.

Trump's policy against Iran seems to be to box them in, and not go to war with them unless they decide to start something. As I understand it the 14000 troops are there to remind Iran that lashing out against the US would be extremely hazardous for them. Boxing in a bully does require troops, but he seems to be keeping Iran in a state of readiness which must be fantastically expensive so as to just wear them down.

David

Sorry Dave, I was not too clear there. I meant am i missing some indications that Trump was actually going to stop all these pointless wars?
He boasted about pulling the troops out, but relocating them is a far cry from ending these crimes.

I could talk about Iran but that will just bring me back to the Zionist stranglehold on America. Iran a bully? Iran has not conducted a regime change in America the same cannot be said for the US. Civilians suffer in this game of boxing in and wearing down. Sometimes we forget the human face of things in all this sabre rattling and chest pounding.
 
Sorry Dave, I was not too clear there. I meant am i missing some indications that Trump was actually going to stop all these pointless wars?
He boasted about pulling the troops out, but relocating them is a far cry from ending these crimes.
Well he desperately wants to avoid a war with Iran, while simultaneously stopping Iran getting the bomb. The aim is not to use those troops that he sent to Saudi Arabia, but to indicate to Iran that he would if necessary. Solving Iran and NK without huge bloodshed are two very trick problems that he inherited from previous administrations. Remember he stopped a planned attack of Iranian facilities after the downing of the drone because the estimated number of Iranian casualties was too high.
I could talk about Iran but that will just bring me back to the Zionist stranglehold on America. Iran a bully? Iran has not conducted a regime change in America the same cannot be said for the US. Civilians suffer in this game of boxing in and wearing down. Sometimes we forget the human face of things in all this sabre rattling and chest pounding.

I don't question your view that Iran is ultimately the US's fault. The problem is what the hell to do about it without shedding a lot more blood.

It is also becoming clearer that removing those troops from Syria was very wise. It would seem Ergodan was hell bent on attacking across the border, and those troops could well have been killed accidentally or deliberately. That could have lead to a conflict between the US and Turkey!

David
 
The NF hardly exists anymore, so why weave them into your post just to get the words Trump and Nazi as close as possible?

Which person had more hateful policies?
But David, it is the same prejudice under different names - Apartheid, Hitler's Nazism, the National Front, Trump's racial condemnations, not to mention various acts of racial 'cleansing' and tribal annihilation around the world. Wherever it raises it's ugly head, it is based on the same hateful policy. 'Anti-racial-differences' in skin-colour, beliefs, practices, even down to ridiculing people's different clothes and facial structure. Our culture is riddled with it, but as individuals we are only 'potentials', we do not need to go down this path. Trump is a leader, a very powerful one, so he should not be speaking in this way, he is responsible for leading others. He should be at the least neutral.
Trump's position has been risky all along because the NeoCons hate him and the Dems hate him.
Any president's position is risky if they don't adhere to and implement the Dark State's intent. See: the assassination of JFK. What president has lasted long if they don't do as they are told? Open your eyes, Trump is the current 'front'.
As I understand it the 14000 troops are there to remind Iran that lashing out against the US would be extremely hazardous for them.
Yes, a threat. And yet the US military has the gall to call themselves 'Peace-keepers'. They are actually war-inciters, and the biggest 'packers' on the planet.
Boxing in a bully does require troops, but he seems to be keeping Iran in a state of readiness which must be fantastically expensive so as to just wear them down.
It is also a clear sign of challenge. It is what brings on retaliation, in the form of small but crushing acts of hate in response to America's big ones.
But we must remember who the biggest bully is, it is America, it is America, it is America.
 
This is the witches pyramid or triangle of manifestation, a magical principle based on the power of three, time space and energy.
Don't knock the Witches, it comes from 'wise' [edit:] lol, maybe you weren't, sorry for poss paranoia! I'm not used to hearing anyone comparing witches with strength and power except in a 'bad' way
I like triangle of manifestation, 3 is the strongest, so most powerful shape in the universe. But it is always the motive, why was something used is what counts.
Sometimes we forget the human face of things in all this sabre rattling and chest pounding.
We do.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Don't knock the Witches, it comes from 'wise' [edit:] lol, maybe you weren't, sorry for poss paranoia! I'm not used to hearing anyone comparing witches with strength and power except in a 'bad' way
I like triangle of manifestation, 3 is the strongest, so most powerful shape in the universe. But it is always the motive, why was something used is what counts.

Oh not knocking at all, I agree with what you say here.
 
Well he desperately wants to avoid a war with Iran,

I sincerely hope you a right here, I think it would only be because they could not pull it off and no other reason, it is a powder keg which would involve Russia. Quite certainly it would not be wise. But it's certain Iran has been in the Empires sites for decades. They pose no threat to the US, they have never started a war but would certainly retaliate, it is because of Israel they have been in the US sites. When the US invade they call it stabilization when Iran extends influence they call it destabilization, you see how that works? It is not so much a nuclear threat but the threat of Iranian influence in the region.

Trump is a Zionist after all, he has made this abundantly clear, dare I say a puppet.

Leaked Netanyahu tape : We made Trump nix Iran Deal.

In recording, Netanyahu boasts Israel convinced Trump to quit Iran nuclear deal
https://www.timesofisrael.com/in-re...el-convinced-trump-to-quit-iran-nuclear-deal/

If anyone needs convincing of Israels control over the US please take the time to watch this before it once again disappears. I am sorry for going here but it has to be done, without knowing this you are not getting the full picture for what is happening in the middle east and in Americas foreign policy.

 
Last edited:
Shall I take your silence in response to my request (despite your having since posted in this thread and others) as a "No", David?

David, what's the point of participating in a discussion forum if you refuse to answer direct, sincere questions that come up in the course of discussion? I repeat my question here so you are certain of what I'm referring to:

Can you please confirm that your position is: "I would rather a policy which entails that women who have been sexually assaulted, especially by powerful men, be denied access to justice, or even the right to speak out about their experiences, so that men - especially powerful men - cannot be unjustly accused of sexual assault"?
 
Why not come back to reality. Trump was elected partly because he promised to stop fighting pointless wars abroad - which he is doing - pulling ou of Syria was a part of that process. Hillary wanted to re-ingnite the war in Syria. Even now she tries to connect everyone she doesn't like with Russia.

The NF hardly exists anymore, so why weave them into your post just to get the words Trump and Nazi as close as possible?

Which person had more hateful policies?

David

David, the issue of passion for so many of us has nothing to do with policies - but fitness for office. We are all used to the US engaging in policies that make our blood boil because it serves its own interests and not always ours. That's what we expect. So when we get the sense that POTUS is not fit for purpose - as LOTFW [as loathsome as that conceit is, it has practical real life implications] we get interested and alarmed.

Trump is destabilising global geopolitics [which weren't in the best shape to begin with] in ways that are deeply alarming. I get that his base doesn't give a damn. I have no interest in US domestic politics as such, and I have no interest in contrasting Trump with Clinton. My concern is focused squarely on what seems, day by day, to be an unfolding criminal enterprise. I know that Fox is dedicated to pretending this drama is not going on. But it and a handful of flagrant pro-Trump internet sites are a small party defending Trumpland. Most of the rest of the media [domestic and international] is carrying on an entirely separate conversation.

My logic is plain enough. If there is a substantial body of otherwise respected and credible voices raising the alarm, and minority of famously partisan voices saying there is nothing to be concerned about, I am going to give more heed to the voices raising the alarm. That's a logical precautionary approach. If there is, in fact, nothing going on, that is what will become apparent. Now it maybe that there are some whose 'never Trump' passion is so large they will fabricate stories. But the 'free press' even with their biases remains generally a source of serviceable integrity.

I agree with critics who say that watching CNN alone is not safe - so I don't. Off hand I have around 16 sources at least, plus books [around 40].

While it is true that T campaigned on pulling the US out of wars that does not make doing so a good thing to do without consulting with military, intelligence and diplomatic experts. Presidents frequently campaign on popular ideas that turn out be impractical in terms of more complex geopolitical factors. So you can't argue that just because T is doing what he said he's do that's okay.

Max Blumenthal's 'The Management of Savagery' is a chilling exploration of US meddling in the Middle East. So too is Andrew Bacevich's 'America's War for the Greater Middle East'. Both authors paint a deeply complex scenario made worse by US interventions predicated on fanciful interpretations of America's role and the nature of the part of the world it has decided to exert influence and flex its military and economic muscle.

The consequences of Trump's action are yet to play out. They could be catastrophic. The problem is that they were undertaken with no calculation - other than benefit to Turkey and Russia - so it seems. It does seem Trump was manipulated into a precipitous action that no member of the military, intelligence or diplomatic communities would have counselled or supported. Retrospective claims in defence of what seems to have been a reckless and impulsive act do not lessen the folly of it.
 
Well he desperately wants to avoid a war with Iran, while simultaneously stopping Iran getting the bomb. The aim is not to use those troops that he sent to Saudi Arabia, but to indicate to Iran that he would if necessary. Solving Iran and NK without huge bloodshed are two very trick problems that he inherited from previous administrations. Remember he stopped a planned attack of Iranian facilities after the downing of the drone because the estimated number of Iranian casualties was too high.

He shouldn't have ended the deal Obama had with Iran then. The US wants to avoid war with Iran because it will bring other players in and become an utter mess. Iran is not a problem to be 'solved' by T. He doesn't have the wherewithal to do so.

NK is another bungled business made worse by US meddling. Again T isn't up to the job, despite all the grandstanding.

We need to get away from this fantasy that Presidents 'solve' these affairs on their own. They don't. They are influenced by many people - which is why things go so badly wrong often and right sometimes. T going off on his little adventures is beyond idiotic. The man knows nothing. He is dangerous.

And no, T didn't stop a planned attacked because he became aware the Iranian casualty count would be too high. That's not how these things work and, in any case, the fact he claimed he did this almost assures that he did not.

The Middle East is an unholy mess as a result of over a century of European meddling and dishonesty and greed. It is a complex tangle of misfortunes barely managed by people who a damned sight more than T knows - and who still screw things up. The idea that T should be let loose in this region sans minders and handlers is horrific.
 
I think you'll be right, Steve... even for those who think re-electing Trump is one of many "worst choices." I believe those folks will conclude if they have not already concluded that all alternatives ensure acceleration towards irreversible doom whereas Trump delays and may even alter that clearly intended course by the technocrat/elites, the morally compromised and the emotionally vulnerable.
 
Back
Top