Mod+ 279. SIMON GREEN ON PLANT MEDICINE AND PLANT SPIRITS

Discussion in 'Skeptiko Shows' started by Alex, Jun 16, 2015.

  1. Johnny

    Johnny New

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  2. LoneShaman

    LoneShaman Member

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    Certainly is. However it is legal to grow, you can even buy it on the internet if you live in the right part of the world.
    Personally I do not think the law is too concerned, there is no black market for it. And as soon as we realize it can help the scourge of dangerous addictive drugs we can actually be effective in treating that and the real criminal element. Safety is an issue. I am pretty brave or stupid in that regard but using any MAOI can be dangerous if mixed with other things.
     
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  3. Johnny

    Johnny New

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    Ok.I am going to listening to this interview this evening then I will comment further, Thanks for your clarification.
     
  4. LoneShaman

    LoneShaman Member

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    That being said, there was this incident that is actually posted on Simons website.

    [​IMG]

    Poor dude would have not known what the hell was going on. To him Ayahuasca is his bread and butter, he was invited to a ceremony. Welcome to the west!

    and this...
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2015
  5. LoneShaman

    LoneShaman Member

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    On the legal issue I think it is ok to consume Ayahuasca as in just the vine. It is the DMT additives that are illegal.
    I believe some people have been arrested but charges dropped as the brew contained no DMT.

    I could be wrong.
     
  6. LoneShaman

    LoneShaman Member

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    This is for Bro.

    Laughter is a good medicine too.
     
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  7. morvern_c

    morvern_c New

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    I like the idea of being able to communicate with plants. It's what herbalists such as Stephen Harrod Buhner and Susun Weed have been saying for years. Sit next to the plant with an open mind and it will talk to you.
     
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  8. morvern_c

    morvern_c New

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    Also, Jeremy Narby or Benny Shanon would be good people to interview. Benny Shanon's book The Antipodes of the Mind is the most comprehensive account of ayahuasca I have read. He is/was a psychologist and has taken ayahuasca over 100 times. His book contains the results of a study he carried out - it's like a thematic analysis of the most common themes experienced by people who have taken ayahuasca.

    Jeremy Narby's work on intelligence in nature is wonderful:
     
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  9. LoneShaman

    LoneShaman Member

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    That was a great talk, he has a really fun comedic style, with some great insight as well.
     
  10. morvern_c

    morvern_c New

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    Glad you liked it - he is indeed very cool. He has just recently 'come out' and explained what he really thinks is going on in terms of the supernatural and the nature of reality. He has been fairly vague for several decades. There is a very long interview on Red Ice radio where he spells it out.

    Re Benny Shanon - the reason his work is so interesting is because he found that people see the same archetypal images when they take ayahuasca no matter what their cultural background is. Which sounds rather Jungian.
     
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  11. David Bailey

    David Bailey Administrator

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    Or indeed some foods - cheese or Marmite, for example. I guess the best thing would be to look at the restrictions associated with MAOI anti-depressants and follow them.

    David
     
  12. LoneShaman

    LoneShaman Member

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    Definitely. Yes there are dietary guidelines, pretty much all preservatives are out, best to stick to raw foods. Foods that have life you could say. And to follow it for a week or two after using MAOI.
    The diet is a big part of the Shipibo tradition.

    Some people think it is overstated, but I think it makes for a cleaner experience though, and if you are eating nasty then it is just going to be more of a purge.
     
  13. Johnny

    Johnny New

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    Interesting interview, I like the fact that Alex gives a platform to people who's field of research is considered controversial or taboo especially by the west.

    Although my knowledge on plant medicine is limited to say the least, I can only say that the shamans obviously kept these techniques alive for millennia for a reason, mainly because they have positive effects. The medical pharmaceutical drug industry is probably the most powerful industry in the world, but they choose to suppress and censor stuff like natural remedies because it probably doesn't suit them. There are also concerns of side effects. But most prescribed drugs also have dangers of severe side effects, I really don't get it.

    Anyway, thought provoking interview and interesting to hear the testimony of Simon Green who has had first hand experience with these indigenous remedies and further testifies to their effects, such as curing Multiple Sclerosis outright, and also the visions of a group of people who saw the same apparition of the Virgin Mary, made good food for thought.
     
  14. Vortex

    Vortex Member

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    Legal or not, University of Greenwich is not afraid to hold a grand convention on psychedelics, coming July 2015 (thanks to David Luke, parapsychologist and psychedelist)!

    BTW, the same University of Greenwich will hold the joint convention of the Society for Psychical Research and the Parapsycological Association, again July 2015 - and the provisional program (including the list of presented papers) was already published (another congratulation for David Luke)...
     
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  15. Ian Gordon

    Ian Gordon Ninshub Member

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    A few weeks ago, I happened to catch an interview on the radio with another David, David Nutt, professor of neuropsychopharmacology in London, on his research into psychedelics (LSD, psilocybin, MDMA) to treat psychiatric disorders. He's pushing to break the taboo against such medical studies (and apparently there's now a greater opening among medical scientists into researching the potential benefits of such drugs). He says he expects MDMA to be legal (in the UK? Canada?) to treat PTSD in five years. The interview can be heard here.

    EDIT: It's Nutt's colleague, Canadian Mark Haden, also interviewed here, who says he thinks MDMA (ecstasy) will eventually be made legal in Canada to treat PTSD.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2015
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  16. Bruce Siegel

    Bruce Siegel Member

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    I'm happy for you Michael! I haven't visited this forum for a while, so I don't know if this is a sudden change of heart for you or a gradual shift, but after our past debates on the value of these medicines, it's wonderful to see you opening to new possibilities.

    My first ayahuasca journey in 1995 was one of the five or so most important experiences in my life.

    If you go ahead with your plan, I look forward to hearing what happens!
     
  17. Vortex

    Vortex Member

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    There is an article supporting legalisation of psychedelics for the purposes of therapy and research.

    I especially liked this sections:

    Well, nothing really new here - Tim Leary (as well as Stan Grof and other psychedelic pioneeers) described the triad of "dosage, set and setting", with the strongest emphasis on a voluntary, consensual nature of the proper psychedelic session.

    Leary also explicitly vocalized the demand of consensuality in any mind-changing practice, including the most ordinary forms of therapy. He insisted that any forced, coercive "therapy" is nothing but violence, a mental torture of an unwilling person. He also stated that prohibiting the voluntary mind-altering acts is also a form of violence. He was a devoted opponent of both "forced treatment" and "war on drugs" - and I agree with him here.
     
  18. https://www.reddit.com/r/Meditation...path_meditates_enough_with_a_focus_on/cul2cc3
     
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  19. Bruce Siegel

    Bruce Siegel Member

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    Jim, thanks for posting this. As a longtime advocate of responsible psychedelics use, I love reading this.

    It's such a clear-cut success story that it sounded almost too good to be true. So I visited the Reddit page of the author to read some of his other posts. Almost all on other subjects, they give the impression of someone who's smart, kind, and low-key, supporting the notion that what he says here is accurate.

    https://www.reddit.com/user/RonTheTiger

    This strengthens my sense (if I needed further proof) that psychedelic journeys can be like NDEs—deeply and radically transformative. That's been true for me!
     
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