Dr. Jacques Vallée’s Diaries Reveal What Most Scientists Still Deny |359|

Discussion in 'Skeptiko Shows' started by Alex, Aug 29, 2017.

  1. KindaGamey

    KindaGamey Member

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    I just want to add that it didn't seem like a fore-brain / higher function like things that require sustained mental effort. There was a feeling in the back of my head where it connects to the spine like an iron pressing it flat or like my lower brain was bulging so much it was pushing against the skull. I was really aware of that feeling as something not normally present.
     
  2. dpdownsouth

    dpdownsouth Member

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    Interesting that it involved the most 'primitive' area of the brain. Makes you think.

    Also, if anyone wants more, here's some stuff I dug up on psychedelics and PSI:

    https://patch.com/california/santac...-study-psychic-phenomena-and-psyche974235dda0
    http://www.stillnessinthestorm.com/2014/10/psychic-abilities-psi-and-psychedelics.html
    http://www.maps.org/news-letters/v21n1/v21n1-59to60.pdf

     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2017
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  3. I recommend this type of meditation.

    https://sites.google.com/site/chs4o8pt/meditation-1#meditation_serenity

    It's like this:
    http://ncu9nc.blogspot.com/2015/02/joy-during-meditation.html#joy_trip
     
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  4. dpdownsouth

    dpdownsouth Member

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    Thank you Jim, I will. And I'll email you via your website in a few months or so and let you know how it's going.

    Thanks again.
     
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  5. K9!

    K9! New

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    http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc608.htm

    http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread890908/pg1
     
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  6. Alex

    Alex New

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    yr so welcome! glad I could be there for you :)
     
  7. Alex

    Alex New

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  8. Frydreik

    Frydreik Member

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    Very interesting interview, for my part especially also his experiences with Geller and Puthoff at SRI.

    (-By the way, not that it is very important or anything , just in case it is to anyones interest-
    I could not help but noticing that the transcript of the show reads several times that Vallee is thinking of and sending Geller (presumed telepathically) "a fish and a wooden shed", but Vallee is really saying " a fish and WATER JET (which he sees in the courtyard at SRI behind Geller at the time)". He is trying to send the original envelope target which is a spouting whale in those two images, while a fish and wooden shed would not really have done that I think...)

    I personally find him a fascinating figure in the field because of his apparent lack of closed-mindedness and how far one obviously can go/ be taken when applying that. Bit like "Ecce Physico..", but that maybe just me of course...

    All the best.
    Lars.
     
  9. David LoVecchio

    David LoVecchio Member

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    Thank you! Thank you! Thank you for having Jacques Vallee as your guest! I personally consider him to be the Patron Saint of Ufology :)

    As to the question:
    What do you make of the "ordinary" way Dr. Valee talks about such extraordinary events--particularly extraordinary science--and does this reflect some deeper knowledge about things that most of us just don't know about?

    I've read many of Vallee's books, including all three of his journals, and it's clear that the subject of the paranormal has been of interest to him for some time. So first and foremost, he's very familiar with the idea that there are things within the realm of human experience that defy conventional explanation. He expended some time and energy prior to his arrival in the states looking into esoteric wisdom and secret societies (he specifically mentions an older friend who was a high initiate Rosicrucian) and of course he had his own UFO sighting as a child. Early into his professional career he witnessed the intentional destruction of UFO data that he and his fellow astronomers had unintentionally recorded. In my mind that's two clarifying events that would help crystallize a belief in things that cannot be explained by conventional means and a willful refusal on the part of government institutions to acknowledge that fact. So now he has, if he even needed it, official validation for his interest.

    Then he comes to the states and ends up working with J. Allen Hynek on Blue Book where, while organizing files at Hynek's house, he comes across what he would come to refer to as the Pentacle Memorandum. This was a document that seemed to clearly establish that there had been an in-depth study of thousands of UFO cases by a select small group of people within the United States even before the famous Robertson Panel was convened. It further established that the information that the members of the Robertson Panel had access to was predetermined by the people behind the Pentacle Memo. This meant that the conclusions of the Robertson Panel were established before any of their work had even begun. What was also in the Pentacle Memorandum was the suggestion that intentionally hoaxed UFO events should be set up to coincide with identified UFO waves in UFO hotspots. The ultimate purpose of this sort of action was unknown.

    Then there's Skinwalker Ranch, and I believe this is speculation so if anyone could clarify for me it would be appreciated. Was Vallee at Skinwalker Ranch?

    So, in my log-winded way, the point that I'm making is that extraordinary becomes ordinary given enough exposure and time and I believe this is what's happened with our good friend Jacques Vallee. Whether or not it reflects some deeper knowledge that most of us just don't know about I do not know. I know he's a man who takes his NDAs seriously so if he came into possession of something like that while under contract for some private enterprise we might not hear about any time soon barring some extreme set of circumstances.

    Great show. Great guest. Rock on.
     
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  10. Alan Amsberg

    Alan Amsberg New

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    I've never heard Skinwalker associated with Vallee. That was George Knapp I think and the Discovery Science people (can't remember the acronym - anyway - the Bigelow folks).

    Certainly Skinwalker is interesting though. I have never been able to make up my mind whether there is anything to it.
     
  11. gabriel

    gabriel New

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    Ditto. I went to a lecture on Skinwalker a few years ago, and it certainly pushed my goggle factor. It was being presented as a window area into high strangeness, and I suppose if 10% of the reported phenomena were real it ticked that box. The Longdendale Valley over here fulfils a similar function. UFOs, big cats, lights dancing on cars, multiple ghost plane sighting, giant slugs, you name it. Some of the accounts are highly credible, others, less so.
     
  12. Alan Amsberg

    Alan Amsberg New

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    Actually, tell you what, I will tell you my big cat story (since you brought up the subject in a way!).

    A few times a week, I mountain bike with a neighbour friend very early in the morning (7:30). We just do a simple easy 45 minute loop. So, on 6/9/2016, we are out riding and we are heading down the home stretch to our houses. This is on a paved road but the road is in the woods. Typical grey sort of British day. 8:15ish in the morning. So, I am kind of looking down and I hear him say something like "look at that", I then look backwards thinking he is talking about something on the road. I see nothing and then look up. Turns out what he actually said is "look at that cat" and that he had seen a big cat on the road further down. He was really impacted by it. When we got to the spot he got off his bike and climbed up into the woods maybe 15 feet looking for it. Quite agitated. Now he kind of plays it down and sees it as no big deal but certainly at the time it had a big impact on him.

    So, now the next interesting thing. This is not my first person experience with somebody who had seen a big cat. Previously (like 5 years) I had talked to another neighbour and he had told me how he had seen one across the valley though his window. This neighbour has dogs.

    So, next time we go for a ride, who do we see? Well, it is the neighbour who had seen the cat 5 years before with his dog. This was the first and only time we had seen him on our route despite having ridden it maybe a hundred times.
     
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  13. gabriel

    gabriel New

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    Strange coincidence, Alan.
    I think alien big cats are probably a natural phenomenon. A few have even been hit by cars and killed. When UK law on exotic animals was tightened in the 1970s a number of owners retrospectively admitted to dumping theirs in the countryside. The typical "big" cat is about twice the size of a very large domestic moggy and tawny, suggesting cross breeding with the local population. That doesn't account for the large melanistic leopard sightings, as any cat released in the 1970s would be very old indeed now. I recall one case of a fully grown lion being spotted by two milkmen. These are more problematic as it's difficult to imagine fully grown pumas and lions feeding for long periods without being known, even in remote upland areas. Nonetheless there is regular predation of sheep in typical cat kills, so ABCs are almost certainly out there.

    Some claim big cats are an adaptation of earlier phantom black dog sighting, but I find this unlikely. ABCs exhibit few if any of the supernatural characteristics of PBDs. Dog sightings are fewer than they once were, the last well attested one I know of was in the 1990s when a young woman returning home had her car blocked by a glowing-eyed dog the size of a calf late one night. A motorist coming the other way stopped to see what the problem was. She asked him if he could see what she saw, and he looked horrified, swore, and accelerated away into the night!
     
  14. Alan Amsberg

    Alan Amsberg New

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  15. gabriel

    gabriel New

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    You may be right. It's interesting to surmise whether they are attached to people rather than being autonomous creatures, like tutelary guardians or familiars. Heraldic lions in particular have existed as symbols on flags and town hall crests for hundreds of years. Maybe their time has come?
    Speaking of symbolic animals, on Monday I was walking my lurcher when a young deer appeared as if from nowhere. It looked like the classic hart of pub signs, totally white leaping past us. What was interesting was the dog's response. For a few minutes before we saw the creature she'd been keenly alert to something we couldn't see, quivering and poised. Normally if she's off the lead she'll give chase, but as she watched it she began to mournfully howl and behave in a way I've never seen her act before, as though it had connected her to some folk memory. It made my wife and I shudder and we exchanged glances.

    It was a rural location not far from home, but I've never seen a deer in the vicinity before. The last time I saw such an animal was five years ago at our former house, when one appeared from the direction of my son's teenage fiend's house. It was the day of his funeral. No one in the area had ever seen one before, and a number thought we were mistaken. If I hadn't pointed it out to my wife and son from the bedroom window I'd have doubted the evidence of my eyes. About 15 years ago we stopped the car for a huge stag in the lane leading to my in-laws property. Again, neither they nor their neighbours had ever seen one in the village. These seem to appear at personal and emotional watersheds, and although it's simple to dismiss them as wild creatures who've drifted from their normal terrain, it's hard not to invest them with personal meaning. Especially when your dog is spooked too.
     
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  16. Alan Amsberg

    Alan Amsberg New

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    Yes. Little strange things like this mean nothing when you explain them to others but their timing can really hit home. So, in my case, seeing the other neighbour the next day made the big cat thing much more meaningful.
     
  17. K9!

    K9! New

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    Vallee was on the scientific advisory board of NIDS, the scientific group set up by Robert Bigelow to investigate Skinwalker Ranch.

    http://web.archive.org/web/20070629172333/http://www.nidsci.org:80/personnel.php
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2017
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  18. Alex

    Alex New

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    thx Lars... fixed.
     
  19. Alex

    Alex New

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    thx for this excellent post, David

    excellent... I agree this seems to have informed his worldview.

    yes, this paints quite a picture... add to this that he has this very French sensibility, but winds up in the states.

    agreed. I like his pragmatism. he's manged to balance the iconoclastic/rage-against-the-machine thing with the life-well-lived thing.
     
  20. Alex

    Alex New

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