Dr. Mark Pitstick After Death Communication Shatters Materialism |468|

Alex

Administrator
#81
I suspect Dr. Pitstick only cooled off on the Dream Team aspect because Alex pushed him. In other interviews I’ve heard on the Soul Phone where no pushing was present, the team was presented without reservation.
right... I mean you have to listen to those other interviews to really get where I was coming from.

Any literal interpretation of what comes through that realm falls flat on umpteen different logical points.
yep, umpteen squared :)
 
#82
Huh?

Of course it helps. First we don't have to dwell so long on material-world issues. Sure, we need to be fed and clothed and warm and the rest. But we can see our place differently, not confined to a little life here, but part of something larger, more vast and timeless. We don't need to worry over mortality since that doesn't affect our existence. It is like being able to breathe, being released rather than confined to a stuffy cage.

There are other consequences. Being freed from materialism means we are not just a bunch of chemicals. When we feel or express love, this is real, it isn't just chemistry. We have been fed that propaganda for too long. It is time to reclaim our selves and live as what we are.
Sure. But those are cultural reasons. After this is accepted scientifically and understood, a new culture will form. No one will point out materialism or physicalism as a cultural issue. Everyone will just know we don't die.

But, Jesus didn't resurrect anymore than we have an explanation of our immortality. That day has yet to come. When Jesus returns (metaphorically speaking) I will be a believer rather than just a curious onlooker. So why believe now?

For cultural reasons. Maybe we are immortal, but why feel it so strongly? The evidence is pretty weak.
 
#83
If you're familiar w/ Edgar Cayce, he was a poor photographer & tried to make money by finding oil wells & calling horse races, but didn't have any luck. I remember one incident in which one unscrupulous person put him to 'sleep,' got some profitable information, & left Edgar w/ a severe headache. I think he earned a headache whenever he cooperated w/ someone to use his ability from gain, not service. It's been a very long time since I read any of that Cayce material, so forgive me if I'm inaccurate.
I agree that including Michael Jackson in their crew was unwise, but Dr. Pitstick appears unwaveringly honest about the experiments, so it would be the old 'sin of omission' to leave him out. Really, we aren't talking about 'Heaven' are we, if we give the post-material persons a residence, right? I therefore don't have a problem w/ a less than perfect person contributing. As the Dr. said, he'll let the A-team speak for themselves later on. Now, that should really be intriguing! Understandably, I am like most people & learning about this just now: this sounds so much like the Spiritual Medium craze of the late 18th century & early 19th century which Harry Houdini debunked & he & his wife were poisoned for doing so. Like Edgar Cayce, there was one man of that period whose name I cannot remember, like John Jamison something, who was a rare true example. He was so successful that he married into Russian nobility, but died of tuberculosis which I thought was odd. Why couldn't he heal himself? He was kicked out of his parent's house for tormenting his sister for chasing her around the apartment w/ a table that he powered w/ psychokinesis. He then had to make a living using his abilities. It was reported that he couldn't do demonstrations whenever he wished, but he had to 'recharge' after doing some. His most notable one involved floating himself out an open window in broad daylight & back inside again through a different window. The 'tricks' he did weren't very varied, but apparently someone convinced him to produce glowing, detached hands & other phenomena that were popular at the time. Except for extremely rare examples, until recently I had gave no credence to mediumship or psychics in general. I strongly believed most of them were frauds, talented tricksters, or great guessers.
*************

My mom took me to Edgar Cayce's house when I was a kid. Edgar got headaches when he would go into his spells. If you have the ability you would never charge for it; it's not a way to make a living.
 
#84
*************

My mom took me to Edgar Cayce's house when I was a kid. Edgar got headaches when he would go into his spells. If you have the ability you would never charge for it; it's not a way to make a living.
Well, there has been well designed scientific research using mediums to ascertain information from the purported dead.

What I find interesting is the the belief that Gregory Shushans research is more valid than Dr. Schwartz mediumship research. Dr. Schwartz had problems with his protocol until Julie Beishel assisted him, or so the rumor mill says.

However, isn't the basic design of having different mediums back up their claims about what the dead are telling us -- when under blinded conditions, more valid info that what NDEr's say? Wouldn't messages from the dead, when multiple people say the same thing, be better info than what NDE'rs say?

NDE research points to aliens, points to Jesus, points to many other religions. It points to cultural bias. There is no doubt. You can't honestly shoehorn the NDE research into any kind of narrative beyond the barest outline.

But Dr. Schwartz says things like:

1) the dead translocate
2) the dead can be here in physical form around us

I think what really pissed Alex off was his use of Michael Jackson. I also think he disliked having any kind of physical explanation. Both are not good reasons. The court of public opinion is irrelevant here. It looks bad, sure, but so does Alex when he keeps saying 'biological robot in a meaningless universe'.

Doesn't he believe we are designed? Doesn't that make us a product?! We may not be robots, that I agree with, but we might be slaves. Which seems worse to me. If I cannot recall how I got here, and there was a before, than some other person translocated me here. There is some other self that is calling the shots. If I have no influence or power over my lifes trajectory -- which our ignorance causes, like not knowing the basic truths of existence and our purpose -- then that makes us a slave to whatever or whomever set this story up.
 
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#85
Well, there has been well designed scientific research using mediums to ascertain information from the purported dead.

What I find interesting is the the belief that Gregory Shushans research is more valid than Dr. Schwartz mediumship research. Dr. Schwartz had problems with his protocol until Julie Beishel assisted him, or so the rumor mill says.

However, isn't the basic design of having different mediums back up their claims about what the dead are telling us -- when under blinded conditions, more valid info that what NDEr's say? Wouldn't messages from the dead, when multiple people say the same thing, be better info than what NDE'rs say?

NDE research points to aliens, points to Jesus, points to many other religions. It points to cultural bias. There is no doubt. You can't honestly shoehorn the NDE research into any kind of narrative beyond the barest outline.

But Dr. Schwartz says things like:

1) the dead translocate
2) the dead can be here in physical form around us

I think what really pissed Alex off was his use of Michael Jackson. I also think he disliked having any kind of physical explanation. Both are not good reasons. The court of public opinion is irrelevant here. It looks bad, sure, but so does Alex when he keeps saying 'biological robot in a meaningless universe'.

Doesn't he believe we are designed? Doesn't that make us a product?! We may not be robots, that I agree with, but we might be slaves. Which seems worse to me. If I cannot recall how I got here, and there was a before, than some other person translocated me here. There is some other self that is calling the shots. If I have no influence or power over my lifes trajectory -- which our ignorance causes, like not knowing the basic truths of existence and our purpose -- then that makes us a slave to whatever or whomever set this story up.
If you have any faith in what E. Cayce said, you might find his explanation for how people got involved with dense bodies. He said we used to have these extremely ephemeral spiritual forms that could span the earth if we wished. At one point, humans became enthralled with the activities of animals: eating, fighting, reproducing, & so on. At first, we'd just slip in for a while to enjoy the sensations, but after a while some stayed longer & longer until they literally forgot who they were. Supposedly, the DNA back then was extremely malleable, so the creatures mated with other species freely, partly due to the influence of the spirits that had come to reside there, so all these 'abominations' resulted, like bears with beaks & winged lions, mermaids, mermen, etc. Maybe all this concern that we become self-realized harks back to the earliest entanglements with physical bodies. C.G. Jung, among others, has taken the Almighty to task, severely denouncing what appears to be an irresponsible game at best. We're born into a maze, which we're thrown into to learn as best we can. What? From whom? Why? At the risk of sounding sappy, William Blake said "we're here to learn to bear the beams of love." But, saints preserve us, what a classroom!
 
#86
He said we used to have these extremely ephemeral spiritual forms that could span the earth if we wished. At one point, humans became enthralled with the activities of animals: eating, fighting, reproducing, & so on. At first, we'd just slip in for a while to enjoy the sensations, but after a while some stayed longer & longer until they literally forgot who they were. Supposedly, the DNA back then was extremely malleable, so the creatures mated with other species freely, partly due to the influence of the spirits that had come to reside there, so all these 'abominations' resulted, like bears with beaks & winged lions, mermaids, mermen, etc.
That sounds a very interesting account - and plausible in a funny sort of way, because it gets away from the vague concept of people becoming incarnated to 'learn lessons' (which are never really specified). Do you have a good link for that?

David
 
#87
That sounds a very interesting account - and plausible in a funny sort of way, because it gets away from the vague concept of people becoming incarnated to 'learn lessons' (which are never really specified). Do you have a good link for that?

David
I wish I did. I read that account in a book Edgar Cayce's son, Hugh Lynn, put together from Edgar's readings many, many years ago. I did find some links for the conflict Cayce wrote about between the Sons of the Law of One & the Sons of Belial. It seems the Sons of Belial believed that the 'abominations' should be used as slaves because their deformities marked them as sub-human & deserving of that treatment. The Sons of the Law of One were opposed to this idea & wanted them treated as lost souls whose bizarre appendages should be removed when possible. They wanted special temples built where the surgery & other procedures would be performed. If I remember correctly, the Sons of Belial got the upper hand which led humanity into a period of great darkness.
http://www.was-this-atlantis.info/cayce/14.html
http://www.was-this-atlantis.info/cayce/3.html
 

Alex

Administrator
#88
I wish I did. I read that account in a book Edgar Cayce's son, Hugh Lynn, put together from Edgar's readings many, many years ago. I did find some links for the conflict Cayce wrote about between the Sons of the Law of One & the Sons of Belial. It seems the Sons of Belial believed that the 'abominations' should be used as slaves because their deformities marked them as sub-human & deserving of that treatment. The Sons of the Law of One were opposed to this idea & wanted them treated as lost souls whose bizarre appendages should be removed when possible. They wanted special temples built where the surgery & other procedures would be performed. If I remember correctly, the Sons of Belial got the upper hand which led humanity into a period of great darkness.
http://www.was-this-atlantis.info/cayce/14.html
http://www.was-this-atlantis.info/cayce/3.html
thanks. Looks like David and I had the similar thought :)

the racist ridiculousness of Cayce's visions is a wonderful gift... a great piece of the puzzle... a cautionary tale about talking to the extended realm:

As these took form, by the gratifying of their own desire for that as builded or added to the material conditions, they became hardened or set -much in the form of the existent human body of the day, with that of color as partook of its surroundings much in the manner as the chameleon in the present. Hence coming into that form as the red, or the mixture peoples - or colors; known then later by the associations as the RED race. These, then, able to use IN their gradual development all the forces as were manifest in their individual surroundings, passing through those periods of developments as has been followed more closely in that of the yellow, the black, or the white races, in other portions of the world...
http://www.was-this-atlantis.info/cayce/14.html
 
#91
Unfortunately looking at the ramblings of the Cayce links (above), I don't think this is really going to be the way to anything enlightening!

David
I read that that was one of the daunting things about the Cayce readings: the sheer volume & meandering nature of them. I have to admire Hugh Lynn for digging out what he did. If you've ever tried to read Jung, he almost wrote like he was channeling, but he didn't write so much in order to teach, but to get it down on paper. He was so well-educated & immersed in all the esoterica he was trying to understand that he didn't make a massive effort to make it understandable to the average person. The man was, after all, a genius.
Gordon-Michael Scallion, who wrote Notes from the Cosmos & produced a future map of the wordl, recounted a dream he had about human/animal amalgams. He said he was a guard on a ship that had a hold full of beast/human combinations. If I remember correctly, it really shook him up regarding the karma he incurred by doing that job. Scallion's prediction of the dates of the destruction of so much land mass by natural disasters was way off, just like Cayce's.
 
#92
Scallion's prediction of the dates of the destruction of so much land mass by natural disasters was way off, just like Cayce's.
I've been reading about impending Earth changes since the early 1980s, very often the predictions are for massive disruption (such as submerging of large parts of entire continents) and the dates are something like 3 to 50 years ahead of the date of writing.

By now, most of these dates have long passed it's apparent that none of those predictions were even slightly accurate. While it's true that there have been events such as the Indonesia and Japan tsunamis, which were indeed terrible, and earthquakes, volcanic eruptions at intervals, none of these really fit in with the predictions.

I've come to consider that if such visions mean anything at all, they would have to be seen as symbolic rather than literal. it also seems to be the case that there are persistent themes such as great disruption followed by spiritual transformation and tranquillity. Perhaps these make most sense in individual human terms, many people as individuals experience such disruption followed by transformation (think NDEs for example) but extending this to a global scale - which appears in many predictions - seems like folly.
 
#93
I read that that was one of the daunting things about the Cayce readings: the sheer volume & meandering nature of them. I have to admire Hugh Lynn for digging out what he did. If you've ever tried to read Jung, he almost wrote like he was channeling, but he didn't write so much in order to teach, but to get it down on paper. He was so well-educated & immersed in all the esoterica he was trying to understand that he didn't make a massive effort to make it understandable to the average person. The man was, after all, a genius.
Gordon-Michael Scallion, who wrote Notes from the Cosmos & produced a future map of the wordl, recounted a dream he had about human/animal amalgams. He said he was a guard on a ship that had a hold full of beast/human combinations. If I remember correctly, it really shook him up regarding the karma he incurred by doing that job. Scallion's prediction of the dates of the destruction of so much land mass by natural disasters was way off, just like Cayce's.
My problem is that while the concept (and evidence for) a separation of the mind from the body at death, and the reincarnation of minds again later, is pretty good, there is very little that is intelligible as to what the aim of all this is - if it does have an aim.

I mean some people describe the process in terms progressively purifying the soul - but what the hell for? At least the idea that mental beings created life and watched it develop, and became interested in experiencing it first hand made some sense - but not when Cayce describes it!

David
 
#94
I've been reading about impending Earth changes since the early 1980s, very often the predictions are for massive disruption (such as submerging of large parts of entire continents) and the dates are something like 3 to 50 years ahead of the date of writing.

By now, most of these dates have long passed it's apparent that none of those predictions were even slightly accurate. While it's true that there have been events such as the Indonesia and Japan tsunamis, which were indeed terrible, and earthquakes, volcanic eruptions at intervals, none of these really fit in with the predictions.

I've come to consider that if such visions mean anything at all, they would have to be seen as symbolic rather than literal. it also seems to be the case that there are persistent themes such as great disruption followed by spiritual transformation and tranquillity. Perhaps these make most sense in individual human terms, many people as individuals experience such disruption followed by transformation (think NDEs for example) but extending this to a global scale - which appears in many predictions - seems like folly.
The ability to prediction the future accurately is almost non-existent, especially years in the future. As I understand time now, it's an idea that "keeps everything from happening at once." D. Radin's presentiment experiments & many others point to our access to a timeless realm where so many answers lie.
 
#95
The ability to prediction the future accurately is almost non-existent, especially years in the future. As I understand time now, it's an idea that "keeps everything from happening at once." D. Radin's presentiment experiments & many others point to our access to a timeless realm where so many answers lie.
At one time Andy Paquette presented some pretty solid evidence demonstrating predicting the future. His examples were highly-specific and detailed. But the more sweeping, generalised predictions which I've seen elsewhere tend to look like a vivid imagination.
 
#96
My problem is that while the concept (and evidence for) a separation of the mind from the body at death, and the reincarnation of minds again later, is pretty good, there is very little that is intelligible as to what the aim of all this is - if it does have an aim.

I mean some people describe the process in terms progressively purifying the soul - but what the hell for? At least the idea that mental beings created life and watched it develop, and became interested in experiencing it first hand made some sense - but not when Cayce describes it!

David
I did some reading about concepts from Buddhist scholars regarding how one can feel more peaceful & deal w/ some harsh realities in life such as confronting the fact that not every thing can be understood. What I got from that was some ways to tolerate the situation better, not really improve it. What is encouraging to me is that if one seeks the counsel of smart & compassionate people, there is hope for the future. There is no doubt to in my mind that the Absolute Awareness is not sentimental, but just IS.
 
#97
Well, there has been well designed scientific research using mediums to ascertain information from the purported dead.

What I find interesting is the the belief that Gregory Shushans research is more valid than Dr. Schwartz mediumship research. Dr. Schwartz had problems with his protocol until Julie Beishel assisted him, or so the rumor mill says.

However, isn't the basic design of having different mediums back up their claims about what the dead are telling us -- when under blinded conditions, more valid info that what NDEr's say? Wouldn't messages from the dead, when multiple people say the same thing, be better info than what NDE'rs say?

NDE research points to aliens, points to Jesus, points to many other religions. It points to cultural bias. There is no doubt. You can't honestly shoehorn the NDE research into any kind of narrative beyond the barest outline.

But Dr. Schwartz says things like:

1) the dead translocate
2) the dead can be here in physical form around us

I think what really pissed Alex off was his use of Michael Jackson. I also think he disliked having any kind of physical explanation. Both are not good reasons. The court of public opinion is irrelevant here. It looks bad, sure, but so does Alex when he keeps saying 'biological robot in a meaningless universe'.

Doesn't he believe we are designed? Doesn't that make us a product?! We may not be robots, that I agree with, but we might be slaves. Which seems worse to me. If I cannot recall how I got here, and there was a before, than some other person translocated me here. There is some other self that is calling the shots. If I have no influence or power over my lifes trajectory -- which our ignorance causes, like not knowing the basic truths of existence and our purpose -- then that makes us a slave to whatever or whomever set this story up.
This is what has been bugging me in the past year or so about many spiritual ideas. The more I look at it, the more I get suspicious.

I get the impression that not knowing about why we are here, that there is some inherent morality or 'goodness' about the 'not knowing', isn't going to cut it for a lot of people anymore. What progress has been made since this idea came into existence, and for whom?

I'm still pretty convinced based on the evidence so far that there is at least an extended consciousness realm. I just think that maybe, it's much the same up there, as it is down here......
 
#98
Just as a quick addition to the above post....

Consider that we breed livestock for consumption. We fatten them up and take care of them so that they will provide for us and give us energy.


Maybe we are just a sort of food source for something else, up there, in the extended consciousness realm. All these stories, ideas, religions and evidence presented to us, is just for fattening us up.

Doesn't that make you look at everything with a different perspective, or is it just me?
 

Alex

Administrator
#99
This is what has been bugging me in the past year or so about many spiritual ideas. The more I look at it, the more I get suspicious.

I get the impression that not knowing about why we are here, that there is some inherent morality or 'goodness' about the 'not knowing',
I totally get it... it's a very strange idea oh, but I can't help but think you are fundamentally right about it

I'm still pretty convinced based on the evidence so far that there is at least an extended consciousness realm. I just think that maybe, it's much the same up there, as it is down here......
I agree. maybe this shouldn't be so strange. I looked at the picture of myself the other day... I was 11... I can remember the voice inside my my head... it was the same... but it was different. it's like it's the same there as here.
 
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