Mark Vernon, Christianity and the Evolution of Consciousness |415|

Enlightenment does not necessarily make you a nice person.
I would go further and say Buddhist awakening doesn't make you a nice person and it is not about happiness.

It is about eliminating a certain subset of unpleasant emotions.

Some emotions are caused by purely physiological factors for example some forms of anxiety and depression. Buddhist awakening does not address those emotions in cases where they are caused by purely biochemical factors.

Some emotions are caused by thinking. These are what Buddhist awakening addresses. Unpleasant emotions caused by thoughts disappear when the thoughts disappear. They are illusions produced by the mind. By quieting the mind with meditation and observing the activity of the mind one learns the truth of this and learns to see through the illusions. This is really the main point. There is another side issue which gets a lot of attention because it sounds mystical. That is that when the mind is quiet one may notice that in the absence of much of the usual mental activity, the feeling of self may disappear too. The feeling of self is actually produced by mental chatter. This experience has the advantage of making it easier to let go of some types of emotions that are based on ego like pride or status or selfishness. If you don't feel like you have a self it is easier to let go of egotistical attachments and aversions.

But the patterns of thinking one engages in over a long period of time become habitual and ingrained, probably wired into the brain. It takes a lot of work to unlearn long practiced modes of thinking. So Buddhist awakening is divided into stages. That is why you often hear that after an enlightenment experience a person has to learn to integrate the insight into daily life. It means they recognized how their thinking is causing a problem but they can't just think differently, they have to learn to think differently and undo all the damage a lifetimes worth of delusions have done to their thought patterns.

So Buddhist awakening doesn't even rid you of unpleasant emotions it only helps understand how your thinking is causing them which allows you to begin to change your thinking - still a long and laborious process.

Many people have a misunderstanding of what Buddhist awakening is, They think an awakened person will be nice, will be ethical, will be moral, will be happy all the time etc etc. An awakened person is none of those things. Unfortunately almost no one has any interest in addressing this misunderstanding and it leads people to trust spiritual teachers in ways they should not be trusted.
 
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[Many people have a misunderstanding of what Buddhist awakening is, They think an awakened person will be nice, will be ethical, will be moral, will be happy all the time etc etc. An awakened person is none of those things. Unfortunately almost no one has any interest in addressing this misunderstanding and it leads people to trust spiritual teachers in ways they should not be trusted.QUOTE]

This is so true and I have mentioned this multiple times on here. I find all this false positive spiritual bypassing suspicious and insidious. It's one of the reasons I distanced myself from any type of group coven or religion. They are passive aggressive Liars, arrogant nasrracists and they form micro cliques and pick the most narracistic person to lead them or guide them. It's a parody of and in itself. Once you speak up on their dishonesty, their delusions they get pissed off and they are looking a lot less spiritual when they were misleading and faking it.
 
That doesn’t vibe with me David. Of course, we’re all guessing at least to some degree, maybe it’s all really guesswork? I’d say that God, from an earthly consciousness pov, is far nearer infinite everything than we can imagine. So while technically you may be right, for all practical purposes, for me, no.
I think there is always going to be a vast difference between a finite intelligence and an infinite one. I mean an intelligent person may take on a much harder problem than someone less intelligent, but an infinitely intelligent being would be quite different. Anything that could deduced, even in principle, would be effortless open to Him. He would not need to test a human on earth - he would know instantly what he/she was capable of in any circumstances.

I think there is something in the concept of infinite intelligence that drains the meaning out of everything.

David
 
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Anyone else have problems with the MP3 download? For me, it's a very small file that won't play in my Quicktime player. I can watch the video, but not download the audio file.
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I don't have a problem downloading. Maybe it is your player. Try changing the player. Right-click on the icon, pick properties, then change it to "windows media player". This might change several of your other MP3's to media player (but I use media player mostly).

***OR***
You can go to youtube & download it using a free youtube converter to your desktop like: https://www.youtubeconverter.io/

^ There are a bunch of converters available free. You can download movies or books on tape with these.
 
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I think there is always going to be a vast difference between a finite intelligence and an infinite one. I mean an intelligent person may take on a much harder problem than someone less intelligent, but an infinitely intelligent being would be quite different. Anything that could deduced, even in principle, would be effortless open to Him. He would not need to test a human on earth - he would know instantly what he/she was capable of in any circumstances.

I think there is something in the concept of infinite intelligence that drains the meaning out of everything.

David
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hum... God. Now if you were God AND you knew everything... then you would be smart enough to know you don't actually KNOW everything. I mean if he knows EVERYTHING, then what is the point? Entertainment?

Okay, so if you are God & you say there are so many combinations of things that play into how something happens, you'd put yourself in a position to find questions. In other words.. what don't you know?

IF he can't put himself into a position of not knowing then, he might as well find a good hobby (like scrapbooking) which is a TOTAL bore... but he'd have to get into that or puzzles cause it's rather a MESS down here!

That's what I'm thinking, I mean if you just die and that's it, okay then, it's all over. BUT, if we go on, then what? What are we going to do fly around space for a few thousand years? THAT sounds like a no go after awhile. "Sorry, I don't want to see the rings of Zazzamutei, I've already been there last century."

I want to be a greeter & when that wears off I'd like to invent bugs and possibly flying things & flowers. If things get too boring then I have some ideas on tornado lighting for human pedophiles. BTW, I was wondering if anyone is going to cry for Jeffrey Epstein? I mean that lady he was tight with just "happened" to go to the in & out burger to read a CIA book. Like that wasn't her posing. Don't think she shed a tear for him. Worried about her own hide. Filthy animals. < you can quote me.
 
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BTW, I was wondering if anyone is going to cry for Jeffrey Epstein? I mean that lady he was tight with just "happened" to go to the in & out burger to read a CIA book. Like that wasn't her posing. Don't think she shed a tear for him. Worried about her own hide. Filthy animals. < you can quote me.
I think everyone is glad Epstein paid the price for all the wicked things he did, and as I see it, the FBI is fully engaged on getting to the bottom of the whole horrible mess. I hope our Prince Andrew is extradited to face criminal charges, and we will see who else gets pulled in.

The interesting thing is that before the election we had a number of discussions about issues such as Pizzagate, which always seemed rather far fetched. The idea that large numbers of people in power would actually behave like that was hard to accept. However, clearly this was at least part of what Donald Trump meant by "The swamp", and with him as president action is being taken.
I can't help wondering where this will all lead because Robert Maxwell got a hero's funeral in Jerusalem after his death. Has MOSSAD used this paedophile ring to blackmail politicians in the US and the UK? There may be a lot of fallout from this!

David
 
I think everyone is glad Epstein paid the price for all the wicked things he did, and as I see it, the FBI is fully engaged on getting to the bottom of the whole horrible mess. I hope our Prince Andrew is extradited to face criminal charges, and we will see who else gets pulled in.

The interesting thing is that before the election we had a number of discussions about issues such as Pizzagate, which always seemed rather far fetched. The idea that large numbers of people in power would actually behave like that was hard to accept. However, clearly this was at least part of what Donald Trump meant by "The swamp", and with him as president action is being taken.
I can't help wondering where this will all lead because Robert Maxwell got a hero's funeral in Jerusalem after his death. Has MOSSAD used this paedophile ring to blackmail politicians in the US and the UK? There may be a lot of fallout from this!

David
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Hon, it is way worse than you think, way. Of course, they use what is known as "the honey pot" to blackmail politicians, business people, Hollywood all kinds of nonsense. It's bad. You did see Podesta's art right? You know about the "spirit dinners"?

This is major "organized" operations that have been exposed now. See, what their M.O. always was is they put people in positions of power to protect them (head of the FBI, head of the DOJ, judges, police) they always have someone a fall guy to take off the heat. (always). This is big, I mean if you look at the entire picture, from the church pedophiles to organized slave traders.

I keep asking myself (or other people keep asking me) "is it a LOT worse now or are we just hearing more about it because of social media?" I think, it's much worse now. Much. We have too many psychopaths running things.

When someone hangs the oil up in their main entry (I'll attach the photo), but when someone for years hangs up this photo in their main hall, things have gone bonkers. Note the red shoes. This was hanging in Jeffrey Epstein's entry hall.

*Sorry off topic guys. BILL CLINTON.jpg
 
*Sorry off topic guys.
Maybe not so off-topic.
I think that in a society that fusses over extremely minor infractions of respect for others we tend to forget what real evil looks like - so we pretend it isn't possible.

A similar example existed in the Catholic Church. For a long time it seemed inconceivable that an organisation that wrung its hands if two people made love before they were married, could possible be hiding paedophile priests who abused the children in their churches, and protected them from prosecution by moving them to other, unsuspecting parishes.

David
 
Maybe not so off-topic.
I think that in a society that fusses over extremely minor infractions of respect for others we tend to forget what real evil looks like - so we pretend it isn't possible.

A similar example existed in the Catholic Church. For a long time, it seemed inconceivable that an organization that wrung its hands if two people made love before they were married, could possibly be hiding pedophile priests who abused the children in their churches, and protected them from prosecution by moving them to other, unsuspecting parishes.

David
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Love you buddy :) You know we started watching a TV series with Donald Sutherland, it was about human trafficking. God awful stuff, it was too real. Mans inhumanity to man. We couldn't go past the first show of the series, it was great acting, just too real to watch anymore. I did watch this horrible (because it's true) movie/doc. about the Catholic church (2015/Spotlight). Again, just horrible stuff. They knew all the way to the top of the Catholic hierarchy.

I had such a hard time trying to decide if I should raise my kids in the church (since I live in the Bible belt). I knew all the weirdness of the churches & their voodoo thinking, how "man" gets in there to teach the kids. *sigh, I just couldn't do it (expose them to that brainwashing). So, I taught them at home at the kitchen table.

I pity parents today. I was SO against homeschooling, now... I think I would home school.

Damn it David! Just when we think we are going to RETIRE to our "golden years" they pull us back in again! Bastards.
 
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