Michael Cocks, Afterlife Teaching From Stephen the Martyr |344|

Discussion in 'Skeptiko Shows' started by Alex, Mar 28, 2017.

  1. Maggie Cox

    Maggie Cox Member

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    That's helpful, thank you Nate.
     
  2. Has Stephen the Martyr said anything about the goals of humanity? Are were here just to learn, or are we also as a group supposed to try to perfect human society?

    Is there a relationship between humanity in the spirit realm and humanity on earth? Or do spirits come and go, to and from different worlds for incarnation, without any special allegiance or responsibility to one world?
     
  3. Maggie Cox

    Maggie Cox Member

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    Gosh Jim, those are questions that I have puzzled over too, perhaps Nate could put them to Michael. Having lost both a husband and a daughter I really want to believe that there is still a relationship between humanity in the spirit world and on earth.
     
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  4. chotki

    chotki Member

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    I agree. Tiso's book based on his wide-ranging research, from interviews in Tibet to Dzogchen literature to the history of Syriac Christianity mystical theology, is now available: Rainbow Body and Resurrection.
     
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  5. Judith

    Judith New

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    William Buhlman decribes just such a situation in one of his books, Adventures in the Afterlife (based on his many out of body experiences). He uses a fictional character who is originally drawn to his mother's place of living (in the astral), but eventually comes to discover it is a place of limiting beliefs and decides to explore further. The implication is that there are all sorts of places "over there", and, just like here, our experiences of "over there" can be limited according to our belief system.
     
  6. Judith

    Judith New

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    Seth makes the same observation with regards to the over-soul.
     
  7. Maggie Cox

    Maggie Cox Member

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    I have already ordered it Angels, I have been hoping that Father Tiso would publish more on his research since IONS sponsored his work many years ago.
     
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  8. Maggie Cox

    Maggie Cox Member

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    Sorry Chotki I called you Angels by mistake.
     
  9. north

    north Member

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  10. Maggie Cox

    Maggie Cox Member

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    That was fascinating North.

    I do hope that Father Tiso can be interviewed on Skeptiko in the future, he is a very warm speaker and, although steeped in Buddhist tradition, he will be able to give an account of his research from a western point of view.
     
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  11. Brian_the_bard

    Brian_the_bard Lost Pilgrim Member

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  12. David Eire

    David Eire New

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    I enjoyed this interview very much; I like and admire Michael and his spiritual insights
    thank you Alex and Michael

    In response to the question Alex teed up about the problems and dangers in channelling...
    There are potential problems on both sides of the process; the human and the spiritual. On the human side there are all the fallibilities of human personality and understanding, which can lead to anything from sincere misrepresentations to outright fraud and criminality. On the the spirit side there are the very same potential problems. In my understanding when a person dies their personal mind lives on in the afterlife; which means if they were evil in life they bring that evil mind with them into the afterlife. Evil spirits can and do interfere in this realm in various ways when the opportunity arises. I base this analysis on the widespread testimony throughout all human history of the reality of evil both in this realm and the afterlife realms. So caution is needed when dealing with spirits. Spirits are just dead people; and like living people they may be of widely varying knowledge and understanding and moral and spiritual character. As was mentioned during the interview, some spirits want to offer love and hope and forgiveness, and some spirits want retribution and revenge.
    The biggest potential danger ultimately is human stupidity and gullibility. Especially the gullible notions that everything to do with spirits is either all evil or all sweetness and light

    At one point Alex refers to psychical research as rubbish, which I find bewildering
    Does Alex really hate science so much that he is willing to dismisses all rational or systematic attempts to investigate these matters?
     
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  13. Someone on facebook recently asked about books describing what it is like the afterlife. I replied with links to many free e-books...:

     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2017
  14. David Eire

    David Eire New

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    Hello Jim
    I am interested in some of the scientific conundrums your points raise and I had quick look at one of the links (Whitworth)
    The first conundrum Whitworth states in his paper is this....

    "Gravity slows time: An atomic clock on a tall building “ticks” faster than one on the ground."

    In my opinion this statement highlights one of the fundamental errors of many who investigate these matters. I believe there is a profound misunderstand built into and expressed in the wording of the sentence.
    It is a misunderstanding of what we call time. The claim that gravity slows time; as if there is a natural entity or thing called time that has a speed or rate which is affected by gravity. This is wrong.

    What has a speed or rate which is affected by gravity is the process of atomic decay. In other words, a physical force (gravity) has an effect on a physical process (atomic decay).
    There is nothing mysterious about this. It would rather be mysterious if gravity did not affect physical processes.
    The conundrum only arises when we forget that a 'clock' is a physical mechanism - not some metaphysical thing called 'time'.

    Time is a derived mental notion; it is not a self-existing thing or medium or anything at all, other that a mental concept and schema which is useful and practical to use; but is not something existing in nature.
    What is in nature are physical processes; which we can measure relative to other physical processes, and then derive our notions of time from the calculation
    A lot of philosophical confusions arise from the natural propensity to confuse our derived mental concepts with objective natural existences or physical things or forces
    A lot of modern buzzy philosophical notions of quantum this and that and weird reality hypotheses are based on these kinds of misunderstandings of fundamental concepts
    Using those misunderstandings to support the simulation hypothesis is not useful imo
     
  15. Michael Cocks

    Michael Cocks Member

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    I am most grateful for the very kind comments that have been made so far. I also appreciate their depth.
    In the interview Alex mentioned the idea that physical reality was a simulation, and I responded that it was a crazy idea, because I had in mind simulation theories that did not accept the fact that the Materialist hypothesis is false. But I agree with Jim Smith that what we see as physical reality, can quite legitimately be seen as a simulation brought into being by a deeper and more real level of Mind/Spirit. In my book Into the Wider Dream I explore experiences that demand that we see our physical lives in this light
     
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  16. Michael Cocks

    Michael Cocks Member

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    To answer Michael Larkin: If you go to pages 251-283 in my Stephen book you can find discussion of Stephen's Celtic version of Koine Greek of 2000 years ago, how it confirms what Stephen said in English, is consistent with known historical facts, and with information only known through Dead Sea Scroll documents. Mr research was vetted by two professors from two universities, who would confirm that the Greek is genuinely from Thrace and Macedonia around CE 30.
     
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  17. Judith

    Judith New

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    Don't forget "Astral City", which is a dvd made in Brazil based on channeled writings. It used to be free on youtube...now I notice they are charging for rental.
     
  18. Michael Cocks

    Michael Cocks Member

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    I really like what you have been writing. Responding to your point about philosophers incarnate and discarnate needing to the checked: I do agree. With regard to Stephen: He did invite us to check his words, since error can creep into channeled commnications. Nevertheless his teachings are self-consistent, in line with the universe as described by quantum mechanics, and if you think Richard Rohr's Franciscan theology sound, then you will like Stephen's. In the last two chapters of my Stephen book, I investigate some strange dialectical Greek that Stephen uttered on one occasion. This led to the discovery of a multitude of cross correspondences in which every one of those strange words linked to what Stephen had said on other occasions, and to known historical fact. I had to go to the Dead Sea Scrolls for some of the information. Nor could the medium, Tom Ashman, without tertiary education, have "found" or constructed such a strange communication.
     
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  19. Michael Cocks

    Michael Cocks Member

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  20. Michael Cocks

    Michael Cocks Member

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    Please forgive, if I have answered before... I have had strife learning how to navigate this forum. But could I refer you to what I have just posted as a reply to Jim Smith's first contribution to the discussion. But I would also refer you to the last two chapters of Afterlife Teaching from Stephen the Martyr, where the implications of Stephen's dialectical Greek are explored. Apart from Stephen's teaching being self-evidently sound (I would maintain) I think that last discussion raises this work above some others
     

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