NDE Life Review and Eating Animals

#22
Morning Fog: you took the words right out of my mouth. I heard about this ritual from a Cherokee girlfriend I had once, I find it exceedingly beautiful. Also, I remember in Siberia there was an unwritten law among hunters: kill an animal as clean and quick as you can, you injure it, you pursue it as long as you have to to finish it so it doesn't suffer. That respect for the animal that makes your body live through sacrifice of his own is totally lost. A crying shame.
 
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#23
Death is a natural and inevitable consequence of life - but why cause the death and suffering of an animal for food (or something else) when you can get by perfectly fine without?
I don't disagree.

I guess I don't view death in the same way as I used to. Suffering should be avoided, but there are many cultures and societies that cannot be sustained without eating animals. Are they less moral even though it is not a choice? It has been shown that plants react strongly to negative stimuli too. Should we not eat plants either? I am in no way trying to compare the suffering of animals and plants and I have no intention of pursuing this line of thought further than this but as others have pointed out earlier in this thread, we should try to follow our arguments through to their conclusion.

I make the choices that I am comfortable with, and try not to judge others for theirs.
 
#24
Once I'm outta here, I don't think I'll give a damn about whatever or whoever killed me... unless they tortured me on purpose first... then I might try and haunt them. :)
Maybe your family would though? Anyway you get my general point! It's the killing that's bad - not how you kill.
 
#25
I don't disagree.

I guess I don't view death in the same way as I used to. Suffering should be avoided, but there are many cultures and societies that cannot be sustained without eating animals. Are they less moral even though it is not a choice? It has been shown that plants react strongly to negative stimuli too. Should we not eat plants either? I am in no way trying to compare the suffering of animals and plants and I have no intention of pursuing this line of thought further than this but as others have pointed out earlier in this thread, we should try to follow our arguments through to their conclusion.

I make the choices that I am comfortable with, and try not to judge others for theirs.
If you can't get by without eating animals then that's complete may understandable if you eat animals, however I was referring to people in our societies, we can make the choice, and we should choose the compassionate one.
 
#27
I'll start with a disclaimer first. I'm in no way qualified to comment on others' dreams, though I'm sometimes able to unravel my own dreams. Having said that, this "neglected animal that you 'forgot about'" sounds like a part of yourself. It could perhaps represent the neglected spiritual side, or maybe possibly some talent or skill, or unfulfilled ambition that you once had, and which was asking to be brought forward.
That's why I said it was begging for analysis! I'm just not sure what it is about. Perhaps a feeling of guilt about something? Or, like you said, it's highlighting a neglected part of me?

I'm just glad I haven't had the dream in a long while. It was... upsetting.
 
#28
In some places, especially for the rural poor, eating vegetarian and especially vegan isn't much of an option.

Anyway, this thread needs @Laird, who is vegan, and @Neil who raises his own beef to have them humanely slaughtered. Didn't those two have a whole thread about that?
I agree - but what about people who have the choice and don't need to eat animals? I also take issue with the idea of 'humane slaughter'.

You don't need Laird, I'm a Vegan ;).
 
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#29
I agree - but what about people who have the choice and don't need to eat animals? I also take issue with the idea of 'humane slaughter'.

You don't need Laird, I'm a Vegan .
I didn't say I "needed" Laird, just that he has argued eloquently for veganism on the forum before.
 
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#32
I'm just glad I haven't had the dream in a long while. It was... upsetting.
That would suggest, rather happily, that the situation was resolved, one way or another and it is now fading into just a part of history. If it was still ongoing then other dreams might offer additional insights.

As I said before, I'm over-reaching in making comments on someone else's dreams. However I do so because I've found my own dreams a sound source of guidance. Learning to interpret one's own dreams is a valuable skill. It is something I can't explain, I didn't really read books or study the topic particularly. Though I did read all sorts of related fields such as psychology, psychiatry, as well as various eastern religions. Not in the serious, academic sense, but rather to get a feel for what they are about.
 
#33
That would suggest, rather happily, that the situation was resolved, one way or another and it is now fading into just a part of history. If it was still ongoing then other dreams might offer additional insights.

As I said before, I'm over-reaching in making comments on someone else's dreams. However I do so because I've found my own dreams a sound source of guidance. Learning to interpret one's own dreams is a valuable skill. It is something I can't explain, I didn't really read books or study the topic particularly. Though I did read all sorts of related fields such as psychology, psychiatry, as well as various eastern religions. Not in the serious, academic sense, but rather to get a feel for what they are about.
You know, I did want to write to you about the other topic, but I thought -- no one would want to read this, I would have to type so much backstory, and that is boring.. -- who would read this? But I do think you'd be one of those people who would be interested and read it. So glad you are back here posting. I love your empathy that you have for others on here.
 
#36
You know, I did want to write to you about the other topic, but I thought -- no one would want to read this, I would have to type so much backstory, and that is boring.. -- who would read this? But I do think you'd be one of those people who would be interested and read it. So glad you are back here posting. I love your empathy that you have for others on here.
Thanks for the kind words. Actually I'm not all sweetness and light - on other forums I've been accused (with some justification) of treating other members with brutality. Maybe it's this forum as a whole which helps keep me away from that track. So I owe some thanks to everyone else for that.
 
#38
How can someone be blamed or judged for something, he has no influence on? Imagine you grow up in a certain part of China, where it is completely normal to eat dogs. As surely many of you have seen in a documentary on TV, they do not treat them all too well. So you grow up in a remote village and copy the behaviour of your parents and the society you live in. You treat the dogs like you have learned to treat them by your environment. The chances that you change your habit if you never leave your village and get into contact with people who think differently is close to nill. Can someone be condemned for that? Even if I find this treatment horrible, I doubt so.
As there are zillions of similar examples regarding learned behaviour, I guess there is absolutely no right way how one should live. Which is one reason I think life reviews are not what people would like them to be.
 
#39
How can someone be blamed or judged for something, he has no influence on? Imagine you grow up in a certain part of China, where it is completely normal to eat dogs. As surely many of you have seen in a documentary on TV, they do not treat them all too well. So you grow up in a remote village and copy the behaviour of your parents and the society you live in. You treat the dogs like you have learned to treat them by your environment. The chances that you change your habit if you never leave your village and get into contact with people who think differently is close to nill. Can someone be condemned for that? Even if I find this treatment horrible, I doubt so.
As there are zillions of similar examples regarding learned behaviour, I guess there is absolutely no right way how one should live. Which is one reason I think life reviews are not what people would like them to be.
I think we need to not think in terms of "judgement" or that one way of living is "better" than another. But there is a difference in consciousness between someone who keeps animals in a rather haphazard way for eating and someone who through conscious deliberation has chosen not to eat meat out of a sense of true compassion for all animals. What they means for the "life review" I don't know. If I consider the general idea of an "afterlife" I tend to lean toward the idea that people kind of naturally congregate on a "vibrational" level that reflects their state of consciousness while alive. Most schematics of the non-physical realms portray a kind of pyramid where folks who are able to refine their consciousness move more toward the small end of the pyramid. Maybe a pyramid isn't the best choice there. It is difficult to talk about these ideas and not allow ideas of "better" or "worse" to cloud the issue. I kind of think what is is what is. Dying doesn't change things too much. You basically settle into something similar to where you were. But always with a chance to "refine" things a bit.
 
#40
I do not think that it has something to do with consciouness. What about people who show strong compassion for animals, but not for humans? Are they on a higher level than people who feel the other way round? Or people who love dogs but hate cats or vice versa. There are as many possibilities as there are humans and no clearly defined borders.
And how are you able to refine, if you always start from scratch so to speak? New parents, new environment, new personality. And again no real freedom to choose, because the options you have always depend on what is in your reach.
 
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