Please some1 help me why there is a hobby to deceive

#1
The reason why I don't and can't say intelligent sentences and propose a meaningful discuss, the reason is that I am a Chinese and both writing and reading English sentences are difficult to me.

But totally, anything like ndes are just fogs, when you attempt to trace them down, they hide or disappear, when you ignore them, there would come someone to provoke that he has found new evidences of God, afterlife, love, etc, funny enough. For example constantly someone says that he or she is 100% or 150% sure about God, afterlife and love, etc, but when asked some "true details", he or she would reply "can't remember", "difficult to describe", "beyond human language", "that's not important", "everything is ok", etc. I mean "true details" is what I mean, there is nothing like "I understand everything but now I don't remember" can be "true details". Will the real people just say "it's not your time yet, go back to fulfill your tasks on earth" every time someone visits the so called "other side"? If an old gatekeeper says the same sentence every time you pass through the gate of your school or your living community or your company, he must have Alzheimer disease, no question, period. So, no details - TRUE DETAILS I mean - ever revealed or told by nde phenomenons, all revealed and narrated are quite cheap to be conceived by human brain, yeah, exactly, don't down estimate the ability of human brain to forge a joke to cheat our ego.

I fathomed a great deal, then still, it can't be, those statements can't be the truth, this world is governed by straight mighty and power and ruthless cruelty, I myself am living sufferingly and almost meaninglessly, meaningless and suffering, and I know there are someones worse than me, more hapless than me. The world can't be like what depicted by nders, all about love? How dare they ignore the unfair and completely cruelty governed by the unseen and unfathomable forces behind the curtain? How dare they ignore the darkness and say some childish silly hoax?

Through my reading accounts and fathom, I become less and less question about the incredibility of bla bla accounts or evidences, but still, I couldn't understand why there are so many wandering charlatans, liars and tricksters around this world to cheat themselves and the others without any shame or scruple, why be so happy so silly. Beside cheating they don't have more meaningful things to do?

Although my sentences are quite unintelligent and grotesque because I am a Chinese with crippling English training, I am eager to receive someone's help for me to understand why, but I know, with my heart, that probably there is no why, no answer, someone or something just like to cheat without pre-notifying or consulting, cheat themselves and cheat the world, adding the originally sufficient cruelty some drama elements. How insulting and dark this world is. Bad extremely bad to the doom T_T
 
#2
I understand your difficulty in communicating in English which is not your own language, but I think you are doing well and have expressed yourself clearly.

One of the problems with the NDE is that it can be a source of understanding, and gives meaning to just the one person, the person who had that experience. A lot of cases a person was unhappy, or troubled before their NDE, and afterwards they have new hope and energy to carry on. But that was their own personal message, it may not mean anything to some other person.

From the things you have written, I can tell you are troubled and have a difficult time. What can I suggest? I don't think you should focus only on studying these ideas such as NDEs or similar topics. Instead it might be good to find some activity which makes you happy. For example I enjoy playing a musical instrument, and get together with other people and we make music together. Doing something like this can bring a lot of joy and happiness. For you it may be something different, perhaps you like to draw or paint, or maybe you play some sport or game, I don't know, each person is different, but I think you need to spend some time with something which gives you satisfaction and pleasure, and if you can find something which you do together with other people, that can be even better.
 
#3
Hi, Typoz, I want to thank you but I won't quote your kind post because I am gonna say something unhappily, but I don't want to contaminate your mood. Although only unhappy to me but I think probably also reveal the nature of this ultimately meaningless and sorrowful world.

I agree with you, especially your saying nde's soothing power is only personal to nders themselves, and speaking to the purpose of discussing this phenomenon, this puts more weight on that ndes are just tricks of almighty human brain (mighty at cheating our ego) rather than anything to do with the reality or the science. But I couldn't understand it is so conspicuously flaw, why someones just happily deceive themselves, not admit ndes and the information brought by them are not reality and instead believe into God, afterlife, love, etc.

As to the methods of comforting oneself or the other people, I'm afraid sometimes when someone has tumbled into a hapless pit, there is absolutely no hope to cure the hurt within this life, and this life of mine is probably everything I could have, so the hurt should last forever. Although there are always somethings in life need us to take courage and vigor to fight for, but the problem, once someone has been crippled in his spirit, he would suffer uncurable depression, and not a hobby could cure that, then his life would not fulfill the most he could, so he would reasonably think it's meaningless.

For example if someone owes 1000 billions debt, he knows exactly the rest of his life, and even his descendents' lives would definitely be being slaves, still be strong and fight? seems meaningless. China is not a socially loving country as western, because such large population can't all live richly and happily, have the respectful social position and don't need to worry about being bullied and persecuted by higher ranks or vicious people, instead, China is a country where different people live from heaven to hell, from noble to beggars. Someone would say it's the same to western countries but it is more severe in China because in western government guarantee your medical care but in China without large money when you get severe disease there won't be a hospital or government to surgery on you, you would have no choice other than waiting for death, and with such large pressure to strive for basic humanity right, a bit of fault could trap you into a mire and that's very difficult to climb out of. Vicious people take what they want, luxuriously, good people or the weak, or someone has problem, just struggle, and meaninglessly.

The most important thing, as I am not happy, as I can't enjoy anything within my life, I am pushed and impaled to be a deep thinker, and I found I'm not the most hapless people in this world, so even if I suffer a lot which is unbearable to me, there are someones, better than me, harmless to the others than me, suffer even much more, so I found how how how cruel cruel cruel the world is, vicious people get what they want luxuriously, good people piteously struggle, I won't choose to be a bad people, I want to love each other, to not being spiritually lonely is much much better than depriving precious things from the others or superpassing the others or treading the weak, but I can imagine someones else are persecuted by vicious people and it reveals it is cruel and unfair completely of this world, the ruthless of God's nature and instinct would finally doom on everyone of us. And yet, seeing nders say some naive words wouldn't be a dark comedy? laugh bitterly.

Anyway don't mind what I said and don't bother is there is nothing to speak to a depressive person, wish you happy. Oh bad mood lets how a chaotic writing of mine...
 
#5
Well, enzymewrath, please feel free to post and write about your views. That's ok. I can understand some of what you are experiencing - though I live in Britain where some things are different. But the pain we feel inside may be the same everywhere.

Sometimes it can be difficult to be such a thinking person. It can be hard to find someone to talk to who will understand when you talk about such ideas, and even if they do understand, it may not help very much, though the load can feel a little lighter when it is shared. As for questions about about god and so on, there is a saying, "seek and you will find", or "knock and the door will open", if you keep searching, answers will come, but it may take time.

Quite a long time ago I was struggling with some of the things similar to yourself including a period of depression, but eventually that came to an end. Time is your friend. Think of your existence as a journey, the path right now may be hard or rocky, or dark. But each day you move forward, all things come to an end. It may be outside your control, but life has a way of throwing unexpected surprises - and something very bright and special may be in your path ahead, even though it is out of sight right now. Don't give up hope, even in the darkness. It can be painful, what you wish for may not happen immediately, but keep on going, one step at a time and one day you may look back and see how far you have come and even surprise yourself. I send my best hopes and wishes to you.
 
#6
Hi Typoz meeting you in this very forum is one of the boons God gives me. Not only because your words are very kind, comforting, and wit, those are almost secondary, but the most important thing is that I see you are happy, I specifically need to see someone truly happy. The more happy people I see, the more beautiful world I am in. But too many tragic people already, if I have always been away from haplessness then I probably opt for enjoying life without being a deep thinker, but since I have tasted how bitter some kind of life could be I formed a habit to vicariously imagine all the others' tragedies.

My bad mood not only caused by my own situation, my current situation is bad enough but not completely desperate, I saw several days ago a news about one of the screen-idols since my childhood, she has suffered tragedy within several decades since her almost disappearance from the screen and her current sad and crazy situation reveals an angle of the ice-hill regarding how dark lurked and would probably continue lurking within our society, bad people seize the power and persecute the good and the weak and the hapless ones who have problems. Evil triumphs and celebrates, and we live in such a terrible society.

Those bad news just recalled me a lot of similar or equivalently mapping situation of mine, although not directly related or that severe, but we are in the same environment no one truly shielded from the dark forces, if dark prevails, soon or later we will all be involved, directly or indirectly. I believe amongst all human beings, people who are not evil shouldn't ultimately go to heaven or hell separately, rather, if God is truly loving, he must not desert anyone amongst us and let him or her tormented and rotten and forgotten, the more happiness and mutually loving and helping I see in the others, to me the more likely God is loving, the more sadness and mutually persecuting between people, the more unlikely God could be loving, currently I have seen the evil occupies the very advantage, and I have seen a lot of dark tragedies caused by it, told or untold, implicitly revealed or uncovered. On the understanding of this dark grounding, lucky to see more truly happy people adds bit of soothing, better than if simply my personal prospering.

In my company, sitting not very far from my seat, there is a pretty colleague of mine who often chats with surroundings and her voice is always remarkably cheerful, positive, articulate, and almost naive, and without inspiring/depression fluctuation, she is always in nice mood! I don't understand why there is so drastic difference between different people's fate, that piteous screen-idol since my childhood the worst like hell, I am at the middle struggling for dim future, that girl, joyful like a sunflower, the topmost, although not the topmost rich or powerful, but seems topmost the felicity. Very very soothing every time hear her voice, and very very thank you to see you're happy, Typoz, although you had once climbed out from a bad mire. I send my best hopes and wishes to you, too.:D
 
S

Sciborg_S_Patel

#7
I think you should look for a site relating to treatment of depression. There are some moderated online support forums.
I haven't looked at much NDE research, as such I can't comment on that aspect of things.

Good luck though, I hope at least internally things can improve for you.
 
#8
enzymewrath, I can tell you are in a difficult situation. Don't give up! My advice is to find some place where you can volunteer to help people who are less fortunate than you. One of the important components for happiness is feeling that you have a purpose. Helping other people who are suffering can be that purpose. Even if you believe in a cruel and meaningless world, you can still help ease the suffering of others. Helping those less fortunate will also help you - it will relieve your feelings of depression.

Yes, corrupt people often take power. They may have tremendous power and wealth, but are they happy? It may look like it from the outside, but I don't think so. Their craving for more power and wealth means they will never be content. They will never have enough. True happiness only comes when you realize that you have enough.

Try to move slowly and look at the world like you have never seen it before. There is great beauty in a blade of grass or a puddle of water, but most people never take the time to notice it. Start trying to find the beauty in the simplest things, in everything. Feel grateful that you have the chance to be alive to witness this beauty.

My words here may sound meaningless, but I am speaking from experience...changing your perspective can be the difference between living in heaven and living in hell. I wish the best for you, and I hope that in time you will feel better!
 
#9
You sound very depressed. I think a number of us have been there: including me for about six months around forty years ago. I went to the doctor and he prescribed suitable drugs that were a great help. Can you see a doctor in China, or is there a problem with doing that?

Your happy acquaintance obviously isn't focussed on gloomy thoughts: she isn't depressed. There's enough gloom and doom around to make anyone feel depressed if they choose to focus on it. It sounds easy, but it's very helpful to find ways to focus on something else. I found suitable prescribed drugs a great help, but I also needed to consciously work at distracting myself. When the blues come on, you have to make a conscious effort to counteract them. One of the best ways is to do things that help you stop thinking. Physical activity of some sort is good. It can be anything: digging the garden, walking or running: sounds crazy, but I even found that rolling around on the floor was useful. Whatever: physical activity can help you switch off, and the longer you can switch off, the less time you have to think gloomy thoughts. In time, you can actively help yourself get out of the habit.

Group activities like games, anything where you have to interact with people, are also distracting. You may be lucky and find some particular thing that is specially effective in helping you switch off. Maybe Tai Chi in a group? Maybe football? Maybe a group hike? Whatever, make the effort to find something. If you feel blue X hours a day, make it your target to feel blue an hour less, then two hours less, and so on. Keep a record if you like; set yourself targets and have something to achieve. In time, you can maybe forget how to feel blue for days, then weeks at a time. You have to fight it: it's your enemy, and your object is to defeat it. Take pride in every victory against it and don't slack off until it runs away and hides every time it sees you coming.
 
S

Sciborg_S_Patel

#10
On the topic of deception, while it may not be deliberate deception - rather simple ignorance or arrogance - I would say the "hobby to deceive" more accurately describes evangelical materialism for the following reasons:

- Dismissal of the Hard Problem. Note Alex, in his interview with Churchland, brings up the fact that the neuroscientist Koch thinks there's an irreducible aspect to consciousness to which self-styled "neurophilosopher" Churchland attempts to dismiss via an appeal to the Mind-Body problem of dualism. This is a poor rebuttal since philosophers have offered alternatives to dualism that nonetheless offer consciousness a place beside, if not the originator of, matter and energy.

- Omission of nonmaterialist explanations. When Victor Strenger dismisses "quantum quackery" like the Idealism of Amit Goswami he neglects to mention that Wigner's Idealism is a legitimate interpretation of the Measurement Problem. He later invokes the Multiple Worldds Interpretation to discount the possibility of fine tuning but this is an appeal to an interpretation that is highly theoretical to put it charitably. Materialists like taking the MWI on faith because it avoids the Idealism that would leave the firmament of the world outside of logical mechanistic evaluation.

- Dismissal of, or simple ignorance of, evidence. Krippner's data impressed the then sitting chair of Yale's Psych Department, a man named Irvin Child. He said that the results went beyond the usual artifacts found in metanalysis and meant ESP merited further study. That's just one example, there are other cases that strongly suggest something is going on.

- Utilization of shaming tactics. Society has conditioned us to laugh at people who believe in Psi, ghosts, or aliens. You can believe in gods, just don't think they intervene in reality. As such, skeptics try to dismiss concerns that reality is not physically closed by trying to mock you and make you feel bad for not being convinced. This ad hominem tactic is a favorite of bigots in a variety of spheres. Scratching beneath the surface often reveals the proud skeptic is deficient in matters of philosophy and possibly the sciences as well, not to mention guilty of the aforementioned criticisms.
 
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