Political Correctness Sexual Assault in Europe Thread Two

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#2
It seems to me that the intrinsically good concept that people of different race have equal value, has been distorted by much of the media in a very naive and unfortunate way. At its worst, this has resulted in crimes being ignored by the media and the police if they were perpetrated by ethnic minorities - look up Rotherham in this context (though it is far from the only town in the UK to have been plagued by this problem). This certainly seems to have happened in Cologne, but the whole process was rapidly exposed because the victims were middle class women rather than under-age girls living in care.

The media have also ignored several other features of this crisis for a long time.

1) The EU could have made an offer to take a certain number of Syrians - chosen to be most in need - from the camps. Done this way, nobody would have died at sea, and no money would have been paid to people smugglers! If genuinely needy families had come, I think they would have felt gratitude and been far less likely to behave badly.

2) There were persistent warnings that ISIS were using this influx of people to introduce their own fighters into Europe. It would seem that at least one of the Paris attackers that killed so many in cold blood, came in via the asylum route.

3) Most of the migrants didn't come from Syria, and were lone men (best able to withstand the rigours of actually reaching Europe). So the EU could have spent the resources it has spent on this mad scheme in a way that would have helped genuine Syrian refugees far more effectively, and not started a backlash of resentment in Germany that may not calm down easily. The media picked out images of families arriving, but when the cameras showed a panning shot, the truth was instantly obvious.

4) The media ignored reports of rapes and sexual assaults even within the immigration camps in Germany and Sweden. These could have flagged up the potential for trouble before it got as bad as it now has.

5) People of different races may be equal, but unfortunately the same doesn't go for cultures. Some cultures denigrate women, and if we invite a large number of people from such countries into Europe we can expect what has actually happened.

Everyone remembers the depths of depravity of the Third Reich, and I just hope this mess can be contained so that we don't see something similar arising again.

This catastrophe has made me determined to vote "NO" when we have our referendum to decide if we want to stay in the EU.

Finally, feel free to debate this issue, but please keep the discussion clean and at a reasonably civilised level - otherwise I will have to close it down like its predecessor. I suggest everyone avoids humour in this thread, because it really isn't a subject for humour.


David
 
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#3
People of different races may be equal, but unfortunately the same doesn't go for cultures. Some cultures denigrate women, and if we invite a large number of people from such countries into Europe we can expect what has actually happened.
?? European cultures have been the prime movers in creating and spreading the denigration of women. Sure things have been changed in the past seventy years or so but don't peer through your biases and think your making a balanced assessment.
 
#6
?? European cultures have been the prime movers in creating and spreading the denigration of women. Sure things have been changed in the past seventy years or so but don't peer through your biases and think your making a balanced assessment.
I disagree. The West has been significantly influenced by Christianity which generally promotes a far more respectful view of women than Islam (there's always exceptions).

Women play a fairly large role in the gospels. Jesus elevates women through his interactions with them. Paul commands men to love their wives as Christ loved the Church and sacrificed himself for her. Christianity promotes monogamy and lifelong marriage commitment which is generally a good thing for women.

"Romance" in marriage as an ideal along with chivalry was born in Europe carried along by the tunes of the Troubadors.

There's nothing wrong with giving credit where credit is due: Western society has done a lot to elevate the status of women throughout history.
 
#7
?? European cultures have been the prime movers in creating and spreading the denigration of women. Sure things have been changed in the past seventy years or so but don't peer through your biases and think your making a balanced assessment.
Well you can only operate from where you are in history. Right now the oppression of women and gays does not come from the West. Allowing the gains that have been made in the West to be eroded because of the past, would hardly be a useful step!

David
 
#8
Well you can only operate from where you are in history. Right now the oppression of women and gays does not come from the West. Allowing the gains that have been made in the West to be eroded because of the past, would hardly be a useful step!

David
?? Huh? So, to your thinking. "operating from where one is in history" means ignoring how things got to that point? And if you really think that there's not still oppression of women and gays in the West you're being very selective in what you choose to see.
 
#9
?? Huh? So, to your thinking. "operating from where one is in history" means ignoring how things got to that point? And if you really think that there's not still oppression of women and gays in the West you're being very selective in what you choose to see.
Give me one single example of cultural oppression specific to women in the West. Or to rephrase, how are women in the West being oppressed? Give me one damn example.
 
#11
?? Huh? So, to your thinking. "operating from where one is in history" means ignoring how things got to that point? And if you really think that there's not still oppression of women and gays in the West you're being very selective in what you choose to see.
Well I don't know what you are driving at - gays and women are treated far better in the West than in many (most) Moslem countries. Do you think we should just let anyone into the EU who decides to come, and allow our standards to slide away.

Tell me what you think the EU should do at this point.

David
 
#12
Well I don't know what you are driving at - gays and women are treated far better in the West than in many (most) Moslem countries. Do you think we should just let anyone into the EU who decides to come, and allow our standards to slide away.
- Homosexuals yes. Women - mostly yes.

- ??? In Islam, and in all the countries refugees come from, rape is not condoned. Are your standards sliding away whenever a UK citizen commits rape? There were over 20,000 reported rapes in the UK in 2014 and over 40,000 other sexual offenses.

As for letting anyone in - I support screening and tracking of refugees but unless someone raises a red flag then I do support allowing them in.

And TBH I don't buy most of the stories. Whenever there's suddenly a reported spike in something that serves the interest of the xenophobic.
 
#13
-.
And TBH I don't buy most of the stories. Whenever there's suddenly a reported spike in something that serves the interest of the xenophobic.
As I think the previous thread clarified, many sexual assaults in Sweden were not reported by the media and anyone who spoke of it was accused of racism, It is good to be cautious/skeptical of the information we receive via mainstream media but there is an underlying trigger for the backlash that we are seeing in Germany now and it is not purely because of xenophobia. Maybe the lesson that should be learned is tell the truth, no matter how ugly it is, so that solutions may be found before things get worse.
 
#18
Since Skeptiko has broken this story worldwide, Pat Condell has decided to grace this thread with his latest contribution:
I have to say, I don't find this guy very helpful. He talks about vigilante groups "defending" themselves when I think the truth is more likely that these groups will angrily inflict violence on the first group of immigrants they come across regardless of who they are or what they may or may not have done. This is not right. The laws of the land should apply to all, immigrants and opponents alike.
 

Ian Gordon

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#19
I have to say, I don't find this guy very helpful. He talks about vigilante groups "defending" themselves when I think the truth is more likely that these groups will angrily inflict violence on the first group of immigrants they come across regardless of who they are or what they may or may not have done. This is not right. The laws of the land should apply to all, immigrants and opponents alike.
I don't agree with all of Pat's views, but I admire his witty thrust against PC thinking & "liberal-progressive" censorship, blindness and intolerance-in-the-name-of-"tolerance"* (even if on most issues I identify more often with "liberal-progressive" than conservative views). He's also been predicting a lot of what's happened in recent months.

Re: vigilante groups. You could be right about what he's saying. I thought he was meaning that this is a predictable consequence of Merkel's decision and the police's non-action, and fearing the "tribal war" that could ensue.

Regarding the laws of the land applying to all, I think part of what he's saying is that those "refugees" were unlawfully brought in.

*On this point, see this video especially (he's generalizing, of course, but I come across this knee-jerk thinking all the time):
 
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