Dr. Elaine Pagels, Gnostic Scholar Handles Grief |507|

#2
Short but sweet.
The Kingdom is within.
I'm guessing your Spirit for that question. Bring it forth. Know thy Self. Be true.
Or else you're a waste of carbon.
Be your unique individual shining being. Not "somebody else" or following others direction, mandates, beliefs, etc.
Our greatest "adversaries" or obstacles guard our greatest treasure. Dwellers on the threshold.
Back to the beginning and the dynamite prize... BO must have given her his, because he didn't end up deserving it. Watch Corbett Report "Hopium" episode if you're wondering...
Episode 404 – A Brief History of Hopium : The Corbett Report
https://www.corbettreport.com/hopium/
 
#3
"If you bring forth what is within you, what you bring forth will save you. If you do not bring forth what is within you, what you do not bring forth will destroy you."

I read those words sometime in the mid-90s in Elaine Pagels' The Gnostic Gospels (taken from the Gospel of Thomas). I wrote those out and carried them with me in my wallet although, it hadn't taken me long to memorize them.

That book and those words (and the many written by Elaine Pagels in that book) changed the course of my life in the most profound of ways. In 1995 she came out with The Origin of Satan and I was forever shifted from my original religious roots.

I am a happy heretic and have never looked back.
 
#4
I felt somewhat sorry for Elaine b/c of her claim that she couldn't tell if she was making something up, I guess fooling herself, if she had an experience she couldn't explain. Then I remembered that I took them for granted, talked about them for a while, & then moved on. I'm no better off, really, just b/c I could tell the difference.
Beginning in 5th grade, my parents sent me to an art teacher where I was taught all kinds of ways to create visual art. Her comment about seeing something as a way of knowing may be related to that inability to tell the difference. Developing your imagination is a powerful thing, like Einstein said. He wanted parents to teach their children about fairy tales & such like for that reason.
Her story about grief & guilt reminded me of my lack of comprehension re: people who sometimes kill themselves as a result of surviving terrible conditions, like concentration camps, that others didn't. I always thought that was such a ghastly way to die: you survive & then you finish the job 'they' started.
After I had supper, my wife told me the young man who ran the piggery 3 hundred yards from our house had killed himself. I never saw him but once when he stopped off to tell us there was a load of manure waiting for me. She said he'd been depressed for quite a while b/c his mom passed away; he was the baby of the family as well. About all I could think of to say was, "How'd he do it?"
 
#5
It's not about what happens to us, but how we deal with it...
"God" or the universe mirroring what we desire. Or giving conditions for growth when more is possible. Too many become stuck, self included. No man is an island.
William Blake comes to mind. Also Robert Frost.
Rise to the challenge!
Just talking to my self.
 
#6
"If you bring forth what is within you, what you bring forth will save you. If you do not bring forth what is within you, what you do not bring forth will destroy you."

I read those words sometime in the mid-90s in Elaine Pagels' The Gnostic Gospels (taken from the Gospel of Thomas). I wrote those out and carried them with me in my wallet although, it hadn't taken me long to memorize them.

That book and those words (and the many written by Elaine Pagels in that book) changed the course of my life in the most profound of ways. In 1995 she came out with The Origin of Satan and I was forever shifted from my original religious roots.

I am a happy heretic and have never looked back.
Strictly speaking, you should have called yourself an apostate, rather than a heretic: giving up one's former religion completely is what is being called apostasy, heresy is just choosing heterodoxy over orthodoxy in one's original religion without leaving it completely. If heterodox creed is combined with a defiant, subversive dissension from one's original church orgnisation in order to establish another one, it is also a schism. If it is also combined with a demonstrative, transgressive rejection of orthodox / official sacred sites and rites, it is a sacrilege as well.

As a former-Christian apostate, as well as currently-scientific heretic, schismatic and sacrileger, I can tell the difference. ;)
 
#7
Excellent episode.

I propose the following change to the King James Bible:

Front Cover-
“Edit: Disclaimer: This book contains many reports of various historical spiritual experiences, many of which were written and/or crafted for political propaganda purposes. Enjoy.”
 
#9
"If you bring forth what is within you, what you bring forth will save you. If you do not bring forth what is within you, what you do not bring forth will destroy you."

I read those words sometime in the mid-90s in Elaine Pagels' The Gnostic Gospels (taken from the Gospel of Thomas). I wrote those out and carried them with me in my wallet although, it hadn't taken me long to memorize them.

That book and those words (and the many written by Elaine Pagels in that book) changed the course of my life in the most profound of ways. In 1995 she came out with The Origin of Satan and I was forever shifted from my original religious roots.

I am a happy heretic and have never looked back.
That's one of the best sayings I've ever heard with regards to so called occult or the secret side of Christianity. I believe this lady has got it down.
I believe the basics of her theology. The book of Thomas has many eastern religion like feels about it, if you dig into them. I believe Christ was influenced by the ideas and practices of deep mediation techniques and theory while he was raised for a time in Egypt, probably Egyptian and Greek ancient mysteries too. Its all the same thing, prayer ,quiet the mind , and get some type of quantum connection to the cosmic consciousness that resides outside time and space ; also do good works, be compassionate , do things from the heart, and repent when you fuck up and move on. In Okinawa its call Isshin-ryū , meaning one heart method. Its also a form of martial arts. All of these spiritual/religious and even Martial Art theories train you for one big event, for the afterlife and the joining back of our mind to the cosmic mind, going back home in a way; that's all it is.

I'll put myself in the ring here , and say all this bickering about say Christ vs this theology or that theology is all pointless. It just pleases our ego
to do that. I myself love that arena of combat, but its to knee jerk. Its just like Martial Arts - say karate or stand up fighting; it doesn't matter what style it is and if you believe in it or not , when in the ring it comes down to basically punching and kicking and all styles go out the window. Its like a street fight. Its the same thing in religion and some spirituality , my kung fu is better then yours! It doesn't matter ;it comes down to if you believe in it and if it makes you a better person, and from that you get your mind and consciousness altered in some form. The universe lets says gives you what you want in any case, as long as its with in a certain training model, just like martial arts :) That's one of the best speakers I seen on this site. It truly made me sit down and look into all of this again from a different stand point, not that I give up my beliefs, but knowing its all the same thing.
 
#10
Dr. Elaine Pagels is a religious scholar, but that didn’t prepare her for personal grief.
Thanks Alex for the interesting interview with Dr. Pagels. I read and enjoyed several of her books.

Alex have you read the Gospel of Thomas? Do you see it as a spiritual teaching, or do you put as part of the purported Roman psyop?

For those interested in the art of union with reality, a gnostic is not a product of doctrine but the realization of a purer state of consciousness. We find resonances across many traditions.
We all conceal
A god within us, we all deal
With heaven direct, from whose high places we derive
The inspiration by which we live.
- Ovid, Ars Amatoria III, 549–550 (trans. James Michie)
 

Alex

Administrator
#11
Alex have you read the Gospel of Thomas? Do you see it as a spiritual teaching, or do you put as part of the purported Roman psyop?
the Gospel of Thomas seems pretty amazing. then again, the " roman psyop" would depend on there being real, genuine, inspired spiritual texts as a starting point.
 
#12
the Gospel of Thomas seems pretty amazing. then again, the " roman psyop" would depend on there being real, genuine, inspired spiritual texts as a starting point.
And they all get passed down and reformatted for new ages, so you'd have to rewind to Greek, and Persian Empire, and Hyperborea...
Maybe it's like all the ages though, just degrades and corrupts toward the end.
The only primary source would actually be direct experience.
 

Alex

Administrator
#13
And they all get passed down and reformatted for new ages, so you'd have to rewind to Greek, and Persian Empire, and Hyperborea...
Maybe it's like all the ages though, just degrades and corrupts toward the end.
The only primary source would actually be direct experience.
agreed... and I can also see it moving in the other direction. I mean it seems like we can all get spiritual inspiration from a lot of different sources even ones that have been manipulated.
 
#14
agreed... and I can also see it moving in the other direction. I mean it seems like we can all get spiritual inspiration from a lot of different sources even ones that have been manipulated.
I think we've passed the epogee. We're on the return. Look out, Ophiucus!
Critical mass. 12 versus 100 monkeys. Cosmic consciousness. Veil dropping, subconscious opening up.
 
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