Skeptiko Community Heart to Heart

I honestly believe that meditation is not right for those who are naturally good at meditation! I am that type of person who can literally go back into my thoughts for hours on end without moving, until they altogether cease to be my thoughts and become some kind of inner theater that operates like self perpetuating, free energy machine. For me, it is better to get to the gym and do something physical than entertain these kind of states of mind, existence, or whatever it is.
Awesome. This part set me back. I'm thinking Damn Shane, are you connected to me in the Ether??
Since early 2020 when I transitioned to working from home, I've had this guilty pleasure of a shower thought/fantasy/mental exercise, which I know deep down isn't the best use of my time, but.. I've been obsessing over the idea that when I die, before I move on to the next life, I want to spend some years in a V/R where I can pause/rewind, browse scenarios, learn, explore, etc, all in a world populated NPC's, but advanced enough that they only way i could be reminded it's not real is the drop down menus I can pull down by blinking or something.
Alan Watts has a short 5min bit called "What if you were God" which demonstrates why any omnipotent being would eventually plant it self on an Earth-Human like existence for the thrill of unknown/undetermined experience..
But I want to play out a bunch of fantastical stuff a god would try/experience before finally jumping into the unknown of a next mortal life.
I've even argued in my head, that there's a good chance when I die that I'll jump right to that place outside of time where I can see all the memories and places that would remind me that i already know everything that i would wish to find in such a VR escapade.. So my thought was to jump directly from this life into that VR place and have some human fantastical fun before I recall any of that infinity crap.
 
All of this thought of mortality and eternity fascinates me! I ruminate about it constantly. I have listened to a bit of Alan Watts. He is such a masterpiece of a thinker. Your idea of the V/R, being so absolutely real that some kind of drop down menu must be accessed to remind one that they are in V/R, is as thrilling as it is terrifying. I liken it to lucid dream states. I have had quite a few lucid dreams in my life, whereas I end up talking to somebody in these lucid dreams about the circumstance, and asking them whether or not that they know they are only a part of my dream, and not real. This brought me to other modes of thinking concerning morality, intention, reality, and thought altogether.

Years ago I had a lucid dream whereas I was experimenting with telekinetic powers in a destructive manner: throwing cars hundreds of feet into the air to see them crash down, flying about, and so forth. In this dream, I was approached by a young guy with long, blond hair, blue jeans, and something like a Metallica shirt on. He told me that what I was doing was wrong and had spiritual impact just as much as any kind of damage I could do in waking life. I told him that he was not real, only a figment of my imagination, so he could not possibly have any objective existence. He told me that there are several layers of reality and that he was just as real as I was. He said that the dream world was just as real as waking reality, and that their are consequences to our actions in both worlds.

I think that people want to create a world devoid of moral consequence through VR, but inevitably, there is always some kind of God coming back to itself and analyzing its actions. The question becomes this: if God has the power to do whatever it wants, then why would It create a world of order for all beings? Shouldn't all this shit just be absolute chaos? Why structure, why balance, why beauty? Also, why should any of us think of us as separate from God in the first place? Wouldn't we be God having a unique experience through such a vessel? Also, I don't believe that God knowingly wanted evil to exist. Couldn't it be that God wanted companions, and so took a risk to create sentient beings that could think independently of the creator? I think that God took an enormous gamble because It wanted companionship.
 
If anyone Here gets hit with a neg spell this holiday season, please tell it to Fuck Off and to seek its own healing and to seek love. If need be, tell it “Robbedigital said so.” I’ll be there in the spirit.

Rob

nice!

I get this on a personal level... I understand what you mean. for what it's worth, my practice also involves observing the dialogue while doing a breathing practice (wim hof). I also find ice baths very helpful... when you jump in that 35 degree water the chatter seems to go away. makes you wonder where it really came from anyway :)

But the real magic happens the next day (or even the 1500th day) ... when that inner dialogue... that monkey brain chatter... really really doesn't want to return to the cold. I found that this is when the fake me really exposes itself for the BS generator that it is :)
 
Hi Atone, long time no see! I think that we connected long before I got the fucking Corona virus in September, which inevitably knocked the entire month of September out of my life, but nevertheless I have recovered despite the loss of most of my taste and smell to this date. I hope that comes back altogether. Please pray to the great God, the other gods, and all demigods for me. If need be, can you put a bird in Jesus's ear to get my sense of taste back, as well? I would greatly appreciate it!

I audibled Joe Dispenza's book, "Breaking the Habit of Being You," and it was a wonderful listen. I think this book is great for people that have never self reflected or meditated. However, if you are well versed at meditation and self reflection, it might be better to put the book down and do something that you are interested in.

No disrespect to Dr. Dispenza, at all, because I found him through an MMA fighter who utilized his techniques to achieve success. I forgot the fighters name, but he raged about Dispenza on Matt Sera's podcast, so I had to check it out....especially after he destroyed the opponent in his next fight!

Definitely worth checking out! - But like I said, if you are well versed at meditation already, probably not worth a deep dive. Nevertheless, it is worth the quantum theories and so forth. Joe Dispenza's is an incredibly smart guy!
I'm happy to have them on Skeptiko if anyone wants to reach out... but I probably wouldn't pursue it on my own
 
I'm happy to have them on Skeptiko if anyone wants to reach out... but I probably wouldn't pursue it on my own

I might try to reach out to Joe. He wrote several books. Breaking the Habit of Being Yourself is a great book! I think that he takes a more practical stance on self transformation than that "The Secret" bullshit does. Also, he goes waaaay into all that quantum theory stuff and how it is a reality in our everyday lives. That being said, I am not going to sit in a room for an hour and imagine that it is filling up with water. Granted, that isn't Joe's only meditation technique, as he has many you can try out. I just don't think that meditation is for everybody. Certainly, it isn't for me. However, I know meditation would be great for many people, and Joe's techniques are kind of proof in the pudding if you see the results from certain MMA fighters. I think that meditation is great for people who never self reflect, but terrible for procrastinators.

We live in a culture that tends to think the grass to always be greener on the other side. We are constantly creating gurus out of lazy mother fuckers that sit around, do nothing, and yet pretend to be enlightened. If a guy is sitting on a wooden floor, in a red robe all day, humming; - then maybe we shouldn't jump to the conclusion that he is enlightened with a higher understanding of life. Maybe he is just some asshole, sitting on the floor and humming all day, because it was easier to do this than it was to do anything else.....and culturally encouraged!

What gets lost in translation is that American spirit that is being erased right now, to this day: that creativity, ingenuity, and willingness to do things your way in the face of all authority, all idols, whether Buddha, Muhammed, stories of Jesus, or otherwise. For those that indulge in that great, green grass of the other side, I say, "Please walk to that other side, and don't be surprised if you see nothing but rocks in the yard when you hop the picket fence!"

I do agree with Alex about that ice bath shit! Woooooooo! I haven't tried it yet, but did a little experiment at the gym. I was in a perfectly hot shower, then turned that dial all the way to cold, then forced myself to turn around in that freezing water for at least a minute! Holy fuck, talk about shutting off the voices! Good call on that one, Alex!

You Alex and Atone, check this one out, great Joe Dispenza speech:
 
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I do agree with Alex about that ice bath shit! Woooooooo! I haven't tried it yet, but did a little experiment at the gym. I was in a perfectly hot shower, then turned that dial all the way to cold, then forced myself to turn around in that freezing water for at least a minute! Holy fuck, talk about shutting off the voices! Good call on that one, Alex!

nice!!!

I really hope you report back to us on the second part of the experiment... that is, what does "the voice" say when you go back to the shower knowing that you're going to spend the last 60 seconds entering into the cold? if your voice is anything like my voice it will bring forth all sorts of good solid well thought out reasons to avoid it. I so, so love this part because it brings me into full contact with "the voice" in a very non-threatening, predictable situation. I found that it makes it easier for me to deal with the voice when it tries to sneak up on me... I'm like " yeah but aren't you the guy who tried to talk me out of a 60 second cold shower?"
 
nice!!!

I really hope you report back to us on the second part of the experiment... that is, what does "the voice" say when you go back to the shower knowing that you're going to spend the last 60 seconds entering into the cold? if your voice is anything like my voice it will bring forth all sorts of good solid well thought out reasons to avoid it. I so, so love this part because it brings me into full contact with "the voice" in a very non-threatening, predictable situation. I found that it makes it easier for me to deal with the voice when it tries to sneak up on me... I'm like " yeah but aren't you the guy who tried to talk me out of a 60 second cold shower?"

try the breathing.

Let the body do what the body is capable of doing - wim hof
 
The road to hell is paved with good intentions ...

Today I realized for the first time what the aphorism "The road to hell is paved with good intentions." really means. No doubt this will be hotly contested by those who will maintain that nobody knows for sure where the saying came from. So I'll concede that from the start, and just claim it to be a flash of personal insight that has cleared-up the muddy waters around it ( for me ).

I'll assert here, that the phrase is primarily an admonishment. That much is fairly self-evident. But the question is an admonishment for doing what? The answer is that it's an admonishment for exercising independent thought in good faith. In this case the word "faith" has no religious connotations. However the original phrase clearly has religious connotations e.g. "the road to Hell".

Those connotations imply that rather than doing good by exercising independent thought, one should not think for themselves and instead follow the rules — specifically the rules of the church, because it decides what is "good" ( not you ).

Later, the aphorism became an allusion to the idea that exercising independent thought instead following the rules is akin to some form of wrongdoing, and therefore deserves admonishment — especially if the outcome is undesirable.

In other words, it's just another way of saying, "Although I'm sure you meant well, you should have followed the rules ( instead of thinking for yourself )."

This realization suddenly makes a whole lot of things a lot more clear ( to me ), like why so many people see nonconformity as negative and consequently why they have a hard time accepting things outside the boundaries prescribed by their social system.
 
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In other words, it's just another way of saying, "Although I'm sure you meant well, you should have followed the rules ( instead of thinking for yourself )."

I don’t agree with this at all. ;)

I don’t see the statement as an admonishment, but a simple statement of fact.

People make decisions based on false or limited information all the time - often with good intentions. It’s that human ‘failing’ that often leads to unintended consequences - but it’s not really a failing imo, it’s just the way we are - at our state of consciousness.

What/whose rules should we follow? I think it’s most important to be true to yourself and not follow rules unless you truly believe in your heart that they’re in line with ones morals & ethics.

Imo a high percentage of the worlds problems are caused by righteous, but ignorant people. The Covid event was a great example.
 
I don’t agree with this at all. ;)

I don’t see the statement as an admonishment, but a simple statement of fact.

People make decisions based on false or limited information all the time - often with good intentions. It’s that human ‘failing’ that often leads to unintended consequences - but it’s not really a failing imo, it’s just the way we are - at our state of consciousness.

What/whose rules should we follow? I think it’s most important to be true to yourself and not follow rules unless you truly believe in your heart that they’re in line with ones morals & ethics.

Imo a high percentage of the worlds problems are caused by righteous, but ignorant people. The Covid event was a great example.

That could certainly be another way of looking at it.

I should probably add that as an admonishment, it would be after the fact — when the person has already gone ahead and done something with good intent, but had it blow-up in their face. Before the fact, it would be words of caution, much like you suggest.

I also don't think we can completely ignore the religious moral component. Otherwise the saying would be, "The road to ruin." or some other non-religiously loaded term. The religious reference makes it pretty clear that we're not supposed to be deciding for ourselves what's good — but God, and by extension the church.

I'm not saying I agree with that personally. I'm just saying that it fits the phrasing, place, and period of its origin without adding a bunch of personally biased interpretation.
 
That could certainly be another way of looking at it.

I should probably add that as an admonishment, it would be after the fact — when the person has already gone ahead and done something with good intent, but had it blow-up in their face. Before the fact, it would be words of caution, much like you suggest.

I also don't think we can completely ignore the religious moral component. Otherwise the saying would be, "The road to ruin." or some other non-religiously loaded term. The religious reference makes it pretty clear that we're not supposed to be deciding for ourselves what's good — but God, and by extension the church.

I'm not saying I agree with that personally. I'm just saying that it fits the phrasing, place, and period of its origin without adding a bunch of personally biased interpretation.
Chiming in.
A large portion including myself point to the Bible Hell not being a place. But rather like a scary “enter at your own risk” sign posted at the gate of sin. And that “Hell” is merely an explanation of the feeling of being trapped in a human life living a bad way. By this definition it’s easy to see how many people “fall into” a bad way with good intentions.
E.g.: I spent too much money at the casino, and I just need to take like $200 company cash from the office Then I’ll win back the losses(road to hell) and pay all the bills and I’ll even take the work crew out to lunch(good intentions).
 
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